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Toutefois, la publication susmentionnée est un compte rendu textuel des délibérations et, en tant que tel, est transcrite dans l'une ou l'autre des deux langues officielles, compte tenu de la langue utilisée par le participant à l'audience.
TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS
FOR THE CANADIAN RADIO-TELEVISION AND
TELECOMMUNICATIONS COMMISSION
TRANSCRIPTION DES AUDIENCES DU
CONSEIL DE LA RADIODIFFUSION
ET DES TÉLÉCOMMUNICATIONS CANADIENNES
SUBJECT / SUJET:
PUBLIC HEARING ON
THIRD LANGUAGE AND ETHNIC PROGRAMMING /
AUDIENCE PUBLIQUE SUR
LA PROGRAMMATION MULTILINGUE ET À CARACTÈRE ETHNIQUE
HELD AT: TENUE À:
Holiday Inn Holiday Inn
370 King Street 370, rue King
Toronto, Ontario Toronto (Ontario)
February 2, 1999 Le 2 février 1999
Volume 2
tel: 613-521-0703 StenoTran fax: 613-521-7668
Transcripts
In order to meet the requirements of the Official Languages
Act, transcripts of proceedings before the Commission will be
bilingual as to their covers, the listing of the CRTC members
and staff attending the public hearings, and the Table of
Contents.
However, the aforementioned publication is the recorded
verbatim transcript and, as such, is taped and transcribed in
either of the official languages, depending on the language
spoken by the participant at the public hearing.
Transcription
Afin de rencontrer les exigences de la Loi sur les langues
officielles, les procès-verbaux pour le Conseil seront
bilingues en ce qui a trait à la page couverture, la liste des
membres et du personnel du CRTC participant à l'audience
publique ainsi que la table des matières.
Toutefois, la publication susmentionnée est un compte rendu
textuel des délibérations et, en tant que tel, est enregistrée
et transcrite dans l'une ou l'autre des deux langues
officielles, compte tenu de la langue utilisée par le
participant à l'audience publique.
tel: 613-521-0703 StenoTran fax: 613-521-7668
Canadian Radio-television and
Telecommunications Commission
Conseil de la radiodiffusion et des
télécommunications canadiennes
Transcript / Transcription
Public Hearing / Audience publique
Third Language and Ethnic Programming /
Programmation multilingue et à caractère ethnique
BEFORE/DEVANT:
M. Wilson Chairperson / Présidente
S. Langford Commissioner / Conseiller
ALSO PRESENT / AUSSI PRÉSENTS:
D. Rhéaume Secretary / Secrétaire
D. Rhéaume Legal Counsel/Conseillers
juridiques
M. York Analyst/Analyste
Volume 2
tel: 613-521-0703 StenoTran fax: 613-521-7668
ii
TABLE OF CONTENTS / TABLE DES MATIÈRES
PAGE
Presentation by / Présentation par:
Mr. Sundar Raj 98
Karas Associates 108
Chinese Canadian National Council 113
Canadian Ethnocultural Council 129
Ethnic Council of Arts 138
South Asian Journalists' Club 151
Canadian Hispanic Congress 159
PolyMedia 168
Hellenic-Canadian Federation of Ontario 187
Polish-Canadian Women's Federation 192
CJMR Radio 203
Italian Canadians, Toronto District 214
Cultural News Agency 223
TLN Television 230
Laura Productions 241
CHIN-FM 243
CHIN RADIO/TV International 249
Mr. Sher Singh 255
Canadian Ethnic Journalists' and Writers' Club 263
CHIN RADIO/TV International 268
Macedonian Heritage TV program on CFMT-TV 274
Catholic Children's Aid Society 279
Ms Nellie Pedro 280
Mr. Bob Cousins 291
tel: 613-521-0703 StenoTran fax: 613-521-7668
iii
TABLE OF CONTENTS / TABLE DES MATIÈRES
PAGE
Fairchild Media 305
Mr. Hanny Hassan 313
Ms Claudia Lopez 323
KVC Communications Group 326
Ms Zelda Young 332
CIRV Radio 334
Mr. Farook Hossain Kahn 344
Ms Estela Cuenca 349
Ms Krystyna Piotrowski and Ms Isabella Walicht 357
Rev. Adolfo Puricelli 370
tel: 613-521-0703 StenoTran fax: 613-521-7668
95
1 Toronto, Ontario / Toronto (Ontario)
2 --- Upon resuming on Tuesday, February 2, 1999,
3 at 1600 / L'audience reprend le mardi
4 2 février 1999, à 1600
5 392 THE CHAIRPERSON: Ladies and
6 gentlemen, I would like to ask you to take your seats
7 and we will get under way.
8 393 Welcome to day two of the CRTC's
9 public consultations on our ethnic broadcasting policy.
10 My name is Martha Wilson. I am the Ontario Regional
11 Commissioner and with me today is Stuart Langford,
12 Commissioner.
13 394 I would like to introduce the people
14 at the head table and review some of the housekeeping
15 items that I went over yesterday with our participants.
16 For those of you who were here yesterday you will
17 forgive me if it is repetitive, but I think it is
18 useful since we have so many people here today to
19 review those comments.
20 395 On my far left is Diane Rhéaume. She
21 will be acting as the Secretary of this process today.
22 On my far left at the front of the table is Donald
23 Rhéaume. He is our legal advisor and on my right is
24 Morag York, who is an analyst with the CRTC.
25 396 Our intention today is to have the
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1 session run until all of the participants who have
2 registered to be heard today are heard. The notice I
3 believe said that we would go from 4 p.m. to 10 p.m.
4 It is possible that we will go later than that,
5 depending on how many people appear today. We have had
6 some people from yesterday reschedule, so we have quite
7 a full agenda.
8 397 To ensure that all of the parties
9 here have an opportunity to make a presentation, we
10 would ask you that you limit your comments to 10
11 minutes and we are going to be quite strict about
12 enforcing this. Again, just to ensure that we hear
13 from everyone. Don't forget that if you have points
14 that you feel you have not raised with us during this
15 public consultation that you would like to forward to
16 us, you can do so in writing by March 4, 1999.
17 398 We may wish to ask you questions
18 following your presentation, but because of the large
19 number of participants it is quite possible that we may
20 not ask you questions. The most important thing for us
21 is to hear what you have to say. If we don't ask you
22 questions, I would ask you not to interpret that as a
23 lack of interest on our part. We are very interested
24 in hearing what you have to say and it is a very
25 important part of helping us make a decision that will
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1 be useful and applicable to everyone.
2 399 As I have said earlier, the
3 proceedings will be transcribed and the transcript will
4 form part of the record upon which the entire
5 Commission -- actually, not the entire Commission, but
6 the panel will make its decision. So that the people
7 responsible for this task can provide an accurate
8 record, I would ask that when you speak you press the
9 small white button on the microphone in front of you
10 and this activates the microphone and it is indicated
11 by the red light.
12 400 For those of you who prefer to submit
13 your comments in writing, comment cards are available
14 at the back of the room and from the Secretary, Diane
15 Rhéaume. If you have any comments you would like to
16 pass on, just write them on a card, sign it and give it
17 to the Secretary before the end of the session.
18 401 Finally, I would just like to review
19 quickly what our timetable will be for today. We
20 learned a few lessons from yesterday, our first day.
21 We are going to sit today from 4:00 to 6 p.m. At that
22 point we will take a half hour break for dinner and so
23 that you can have a bit of a break as well. We will
24 reconvene at 6:30. We will sit until 8:30. We will
25 take a 15-minute break, reconvene at 8:45 and go
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1 probably until the end at that point.
2 402 So, having said all of that, I would
3 ask our Secretary to call the first party.
4 403 MS RHÉAUME: Our first speaker is Mr.
5 Sundar Raj.
6 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
7 404 MR. RAJ: Good afternoon, ladies and
8 gentlemen.
9 405 Commissioners, ladies and gentlemen,
10 my name is Sundar Raj. I am a marketing and business
11 consultant and I appear before you this evening for a
12 number of reasons.
13 406 As a Canadian I am interested in and
14 concerned about the long-term impacts of media on all
15 segments of our society.
16 407 Prior to coming to Canada in 1971, I
17 was fortunate enough to have had a choice as to where I
18 wanted to live and where I could live. I chose to live
19 in Canada as I was indeed, and I am even now,
20 fascinated with the concept of the cultural mosaic
21 philosophy as against the melting pot concept.
22 408 I am actively associated with the
23 Flemingdon Neighbourhood Services as a member of its
24 board and through this organization with the
25 Thorncliffe Park Neighbourhood Services. Both these
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1 community service organization serve two high density
2 and ethnically diverse areas of Toronto. Both are now
3 the favoured starting points for those who come from
4 around the world for a varied number of reasons to
5 settle in Canada. Nor many of them speak or understand
6 either of our official languages.
7 409 I am an active Rotarian and Past
8 President of the Don Mills Rotary Club. Don Mills in
9 Toronto is another community that has undergone major
10 changes in its ethnic composition over the past 25
11 years.
12 410 I have had the pleasure of seeing
13 this beautiful land coast to coast many times and have
14 interacted socially and on business with a wide range
15 of Canadians from different ethnocultural and
16 linguistic backgrounds. I have thus come to understand
17 and to appreciate in my own way what makes this country
18 unique in the world.
19 411 I am a consultant to Asian Television
20 Network International of Newmarket, Ontario, which is
21 licensed by the Commission to provide the first and
22 only 24 hour a day, seven days a week, channel to serve
23 the needs of the South Asian community across Canada.
24 I have had the privilege of appearing before this
25 Commission in 1996 as a member of the ATN team.
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1 412 Having established my credentials, I
2 wish to bring to your attention my observations on the
3 following:
4 413 One, the adequacy of the present
5 broadcasting system from an ethnocultural perspective;
6 414 Two, the urgent need for a new policy
7 framework to better serve the needs of the fast growing
8 ethnocultural communities.
9 415 Let me pause briefly to highlight one
10 of the biggest challenges faced by non-English or
11 non-French speaking immigrants to our country. It is
12 the challenge of cultural isolation. This is more so
13 in the case of senior citizens and women with young
14 non-school going children. They spend a major part of
15 their working days alone or with toddlers within the
16 confines of their homes. Their world outside the home
17 is also restricted to a few and far in between
18 community events. They are also heavily dependent on
19 the meagre social services provided by our resource
20 constrained service agencies.
21 416 In the above-referred group, the
22 problem is more acute among immigrants from the
23 non-traditional sources such as Asia and Africa. While
24 Asian immigrants have settled in Canada in substantial
25 numbers since the late sixties, it is only in the last
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1 eight to ten years that people from countries such as
2 Sri Lanka, for example, have arrived in Canada to form
3 their own communities. Same is the case with people
4 from countries such as Ethiopia or Somalia or Ghana.
5 All these people live in the Flemingdon area. I know
6 this as a director of the Flemingdon Centre.
7 417 These communities do not have the
8 benefits of social and organizational structures that
9 are provided by long established and well-managed
10 churches or religious institutions.
11 418 Modern travel makes it possible for
12 people to move from one region of the world to the
13 other in a matter of hours. Though this physical
14 transportation is achieved in a matter of hours, the
15 cultural and social adjustments take many years.
16 People from far away lands have thus been transplanted
17 to Canada within hours and here they re with little or
18 no understanding of our languages or culture or social
19 and societal values. For these people it is a delight
20 to hear a familiar sound or see a picture that they can
21 recognize. It is like seeing an oasis in a vast
22 desert.
23 419 It is with this background that I ask
24 the moot question: How well is our current system of
25 television networks and radio stations serving our
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1 diverse needs?
2 420 I wish to further illustrate this
3 point with a personal example. In the mid-seventies,
4 my mother spent a few years with us here in Canada.
5 Even though she enjoyed watching some of the programs
6 on the English-language channels, the only ones that
7 were available in those days, she always looked forward
8 to the Saturday morning 30-minute program that my good
9 friend and much respected pioneer of South Asian
10 television programming, Shan Chandrasekar, used to
11 broadcast. Our Saturdays would not be complete without
12 this 30 minutes of South Asian programming. How I wish
13 that those days we had the Asian Television channel on
14 a daily basis.
15 421 However, I should hasten to point out
16 an ironic situation that exists now. Even though the
17 South Asian channel was licensed by the Commission two
18 years ago, many of us who want this service and are
19 prepared to pay the premium price for the channel are
20 unable to do so because of the cable companies'
21 inability to provide this channel. Many of us who live
22 in high-rise buildings cannot have the satellite dish
23 and are dependent totally on the cable service
24 providers' decision on the menu of options offered to
25 subscribers.
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1 422 I live in what can be called a luxury
2 high rise in Toronto which is completely boxed in.
3 There is no balcony and the building authorities are
4 extremely friendly and favourable, but they cannot give
5 me the channels that I want because the cable company
6 decides what I watch.
7 423 Furthermore, what is intriguing is
8 that within the Greater Toronto Area, demographics
9 clearly illustrate that South Asians form the second
10 largest minority group after the Chinese community.
11 Yet, two years have gone by since the Commission
12 granted a licence for the South Asian channel and we
13 are yet to see its benefits.
14 424 This is an example of good policies
15 not yielding their full benefits to the targeted
16 groups. Cable carriers and other distributors must be
17 an integral part of the implementation process in the
18 CRTC's decision process. Without such fully integrated
19 implementation programs, good policies of the
20 Commission come to yield little or no real benefit to
21 the consumers.
22 425 At this stage I wish to move on to
23 another factor that needs to be recognized in the
24 framework of a third language programming policy.
25 There is an interesting social trend emerging in
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1 Canada. We generally assume that language and
2 ethnicity are correlated and, therefore, as an example,
3 we assume that people of Portuguese origin are the only
4 ones interested in Portuguese programs. While this
5 pattern fits the conventional wisdom, it is important
6 to notice that it is somewhat limiting.
7 426 Today, because of the many
8 cross-cultural influences that the younger generations
9 are exposed to in urban areas, such as Toronto and
10 Vancouver, the younger generations have cultural and
11 artistic interests outside and beyond their own ethnic
12 origins. People of non-South Asian background have
13 often commented to me that they enjoy watching a South
14 Asian program on the TV or attending a South Asian
15 cultural program in their community.
16 427 When I have a few moments to spare, I
17 surf the channels to watch a Ukrainian dance or a
18 Scottish jig or an Italian opera. My son, who is 23
19 years old, has a job that needs good language skills in
20 both English and French. He often times tunes into a
21 French channel to upgrade his colloquial French. I
22 have often heard people of this age group talking of
23 their plans to acquire new languages such as Spanish,
24 Japanese or Chinese -- languages that one does not
25 normally associate with their ethnic backgrounds.
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1 428 A dynamic third language programming
2 policy will have a crucial impact in the future much
3 beyond the targeted ethnocultural groups. Its impact
4 will be on our society as a whole because of the large
5 scale social integration that is taking place as never
6 before in our history. As barriers are coming down
7 fast, it is important to provide outlets for the art,
8 culture and talent that exist in different ethnic
9 segments to reach out to one another and enjoy the rich
10 diverse heritage as a part and parcel of the overall
11 Canadian mosaic.
12 429 A dynamic third language policy will
13 have a long term impact on Canada's global image and
14 aspirations. We are a trading nation intent on
15 promoting and pursuing trade opportunities around the
16 world. Our foreign policy is committed to promote
17 peace and understanding. We tackle ecological and
18 environmental challenges around the world. We help
19 countries affected by natural disasters. Our ability
20 to pursue these noble objectives in a global context
21 will be further enhanced when we have a cadre of young
22 men and women sensitive to and well attuned to the
23 cultural needs of other countries around the world.
24 430 I can further highlight many of the
25 benefits of a dynamic third language policy. However,
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1 in the interest of time and brevity, let me at this
2 stage pose a question. Should third-language channels
3 be made available on a premium pay for service basis or
4 as a part of the basic cable package? There are
5 obviously a number of other issues that need to be
6 considered in this context and solutions are neither
7 simple nor easy to find.
8 431 Finally, let us evolve a dynamic
9 third language programming policy that meets the needs
10 of our fast changing society. Let this new policy take
11 us all to the 21st century and thew millennium.
12 However, let us proceed with caution and protect the
13 third-language channels that are now in operation.
14 These channels must be allowed to grow and to attain
15 their full potential. Let us nourish the many talents
16 that exist within our shores before we open the gates
17 for unlimited access to mere importers of foreign
18 programs in third languages. Let those who took the
19 initiatives in Canada benefit from their enterprises
20 and let Canadian talent in third language programming
21 and program delivery thrive.
22 432 That concludes my presentation.
23 Merci beaucoup.
24 433 THE CHAIRPERSON: Commissioner
25 Langford has a question for you.
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1 434 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: Thank you
2 very much for that. I must say that had you been here
3 last night you would have heard a number of people make
4 some of the same comments you made with regard to
5 dealing with landlords and trying to get them to
6 lighten up and let them put satellite dishes on their
7 balconies and be a little more open to perhaps a
8 different cable provider.
9 435 Do you know whether these concerns
10 are being brought to the provincial government? I
11 don't want to sound like I am passing the buck here,
12 but landlord and tenant law is a provincial
13 responsibility. Do you know whether the people who are
14 speaking out, and I should have asked this last night I
15 suppose and if you don't know that's fine, but do you
16 know whether there is some pressure being brought at
17 the provincial level as well?
18 436 MR. RAJ: Commissioner, not to my
19 knowledge because one of the problems that we need to
20 recognize in the context of your question is not many
21 people have the time or the other resources to follow
22 through. When I phone downstairs to my management
23 office and they say, no, you cannot have a dish, it's
24 against the by-laws of the building, that ends my
25 enthusiasm for acquiring this new technology.
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1 437 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: Well, keep
2 the pressure on us, but look to Queen's Park a little
3 as well. I think maybe with a pincer movement maybe we
4 can move this along a little.
5 438 Thanks very much.
6 439 MR. RAJ: Thank you.
7 440 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
8 much, Mr. Raj.
9 441 MS RHÉAUME: Our next speaker is Mr.
10 Sergio Karas of Karas Associates.
11 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
12 442 MR. KARAS: Thank you, Madam Chair.
13 443 My name is Sergio Karas. I am a
14 barrister and solicitor, a lawyer here in Toronto. I
15 practice in the area of immigration law. I am here as
16 a private citizen, but also because I have a personal
17 interest in the matter. I am immigrant myself. My
18 first language was not English. My first language is
19 Spanish and I was born in Buenos Aires, Argentina.
20 444 I have been in Canada for over 18
21 years and I was fortunate enough to attend university,
22 York University and Osgoode Hall law school here in
23 Toronto, so I received all my post-secondary education
24 in Canada.
25 445 I am also very active in the question
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1 of ethnic media because I write in ethnic newspapers on
2 a regular basis, both here and in the United States. I
3 am also a frequent guest in different programs of
4 different ethnic groups to inform people on immigration
5 issues. So my comments will be of a practical nature
6 more than anything else and based on my personal
7 experience on the matter.
8 446 I am also a director of the Jewish
9 Immigrant Aid Service, so I am very active in the
10 community in assisting immigrants. My office basically
11 handles cases of all ethnic groups.
12 447 I think that you are faced with a
13 basic dichotomy here, a basic dilemma, whether or not
14 there should be more Canadian local content or it
15 should be more internationalized. Whilst I am a very
16 big sympathizer of the idea that people should be able
17 to watch whatever they please and I don't care really
18 what it comes from, I am a believer in freedom of
19 choice as far as programming is concerned. So, if
20 anybody wants to get a satellite and watch, I don't
21 know, a cricket match, they are welcome to do so.
22 Whereas if anybody wants to watch the local news they
23 are welcome to do so too.
24 448 However, I think that the role of the
25 local stations or stations that are carried on cable
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1 that cater to specific ethnic groups should
2 nevertheless address those ethnic groups. For example,
3 my personal experience indicates to me that people do
4 rely to a great extent to get Canadian information from
5 those programs that they see from time to time. They
6 expect those programs to have accurate, reliable
7 information that they can depend on.
8 449 I am a frequent guest on certain talk
9 shows for different cable stations and I am privileged
10 to handle calls, for example, from people. On occasion
11 we receive calls from Edmonton, from Calgary, from
12 Montreal, Toronto and people feel somewhat
13 disconnected, particularly those who are living in
14 smaller communities where their own ethnic group is not
15 so prevalent.
16 450 I think it is very easy to talk about
17 ethnic programming for large groups -- large ethnic
18 groups in, for example, major cities such as Toronto,
19 Montreal or Vancouver where they are a very high
20 percentage of the population. For example, if we talk
21 about Spanish-speaking people, since I am one I will
22 talk about that. If we talk about Spanish-speaking
23 people in Toronto, there is a very sizeable group,
24 approximately 250,000. However, there are, I am told,
25 around half a million Spanish-speaking people
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1 throughout Canada, but if you live in a place such as
2 Calgary, for example, or such as a smaller city, there
3 are not as many.
4 451 So you come to expect to have that
5 program in the local television station or in the cable
6 television station to handle local questions or things
7 that are of your interest. A lot of people rely on
8 ethnic programming for their information. For some
9 people this is their only source of information.
10 452 In my own particular field,
11 immigration law, every time we have a program on any
12 ethnic channel we are bombarded with phone calls
13 because people feel disconnected and this is a way that
14 they can prevent their own alienation from the rest of
15 the Canadian mainstream.
16 453 Unfortunately, some groups are a
17 little more disadvantaged than others. For some
18 people, for example, my friend who just spoke before
19 referred to South Asians, well, a lot of South Asians
20 have English as their language of instruction.
21 Whereas, for example, Spanish-speaking people they
22 don't. So they rely more on the ethnic programming
23 that they are expecting to hear.
24 454 There are specific needs also that
25 have to be addressed and cannot be addressed elsewhere.
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1 People rely on those programs as they are a source of
2 information that they really cannot find elsewhere.
3 455 It is also important that there
4 should be Canada-wide coverage, that cable stations
5 carry those programs without additional charges, and
6 that a real concerned effort be made to procure
7 corporate sponsorship of programs which in some groups
8 is sorely lacking.
9 456 I tell you, every time I turn on the
10 TV I don't see any major corporations sponsoring ethnic
11 programming, except for certain groups because,
12 obviously, there is a critical mass in their own
13 market. But I think there has to be some way, through
14 tax credits perhaps or through some sort of incentive
15 to promote corporations to provide that critical
16 advertising for those stations. There should also be a
17 duty from the part of those stations to carry local
18 news, for example, because people do come to expect
19 that.
20 457 So, those are my comments and I thank
21 you very, very much. They are intended to be of a
22 practical nature based on my own experience. I will be
23 happy to answer any questions you may have.
24 458 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much
25 for your contribution, Mr. Karas.
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1 459 MR. KARAS: Thank you.
2 460 MS RHÉAUME: Our next presentation is
3 by Mr. Jonas Ma of the Chinese Canadian National
4 Council.
5 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
6 461 MR. MA: Thank you, Madam Chair.
7 Bonjour.
8 462 My name is Jonas Ma. I am the
9 Executive Director of the Chinese Canadian National
10 Council. The Chinese Canadian National Council is a
11 national umbrella organization with 30 chapters across
12 the nation. Our mandate is to promote the equal rights
13 and full participation of Chinese Canadians at all
14 levels of society.
15 463 Our input on ethnic programming is
16 principled on the promotion of equality -- the value
17 enshrined in the Canadian Charter of Rights and
18 Freedoms -- through encouraging accessibility to
19 services, diversity in programs and anti-discrimination
20 programming. While our input may be applicable to the
21 situation of ethnic programming in general, it is
22 principally focused on ethnic programming for the
23 Chinese Canadian population.
24 464 Let's start by looking at some of the
25 demographics that are changing. According to the 1996
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1 census, visible minorities now make up over 11 per cent
2 of Canada's population. Chinese Canadians which number
3 over 920,000 in Canada are the largest visible minority
4 in Canada, making up about 26 per cent of this
5 population. The majority of Chinese Canadians can be
6 found in Ontario and B.C. We represent 8.5 per cent of
7 the population of Toronto and 16 per cent of the
8 population of Vancouver.
9 465 In Canada, the mother tongue of over
10 16 per cent of our population is a non-official
11 language, with Chinese holding the largest percentage
12 in that group, about 11 per cent or over 715,000.
13 466 Within the Chinese Canadian
14 population itself there are also demographic changes.
15 In recent years there is a large influx of immigrants
16 who are from the People's Republic of China, who speak
17 Mandarin, compared to the last couple of decades when
18 Chinese immigrants were mostly from Hong Kong and
19 Taiwan.
20 467 In light of the changing demographics
21 of Canadian society, let me now introduce Ms Paula Jong
22 who is a member of our National Executive to point out
23 some of the concerns that we have in ethnic and third
24 language broadcasting policy.
25 468 MS JONG: First, I am going to
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1 address accessibility to services. Even though ethnic
2 programming is becoming increasingly important, the
3 provision of current services is dependent on the
4 private market. Those who do not subscribe to cable
5 television often do not have access to services.
6 Viewers have to pay additional subscription fees in
7 order to gain full access to the available third
8 language specialty television stations. Third language
9 radio stations, which rely on advertising revenue, only
10 operate in big cities like Toronto and Vancouver, where
11 it is financially viable to do so. Geographically
12 isolated communities usually have no or limited access
13 to these services, except for those who can afford to
14 purchase the necessary technology to increase their
15 access.
16 469 Without public subsidies, access to
17 ethnic programming will continue to be limited to those
18 who have sufficient resources. moreover, with the
19 government moving towards privatization, ethnic
20 programming which is not profitable, but serves an
21 important social purpose, will be eliminated. For
22 example, community channels which can carry ethnic
23 programming have been sold off to specialty channels,
24 like the Golf Channel.
25 470 Now I am going to move on to
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1 diversity in programs. Currently, ethnic programming
2 for Chinese Canadian communities is provided mainly
3 through ethnic broadcasting and third language
4 specialty stations, in the form of Type A programs.
5 Their programs mainly focus on providing viewers with a
6 link or connection to their countries of origin; they
7 provide social, cultural and political information
8 about those countries.
9 471 To this end, they are serving the
10 Chinese Canadian communities whose countries of origin
11 are Hong Kong and Taiwan very well. However, there are
12 very few, if any, programs that are produced for
13 Chinese Canadians from other countries of origin, for
14 example, those who are from the People's Republic of
15 China. moreover, the majority of the non-news
16 television programs and the music on radio are overseas
17 productions which are imported by the stations.
18 472 Besides providing viewers with a link
19 to their countries of origin, ethnic third language
20 broadcasting stations also serve to familiarize viewers
21 with Canadian social and political issues, and to
22 facilitate participation and integration into Canadian
23 society. While there are set requirement on Canadian
24 content for those stations, there are not any
25 requirements or guidelines on the specific types of
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1 Canadian content programs. Moreover, more programs are
2 needed in areas which concern the social, political and
3 cross-cultural aspects of Canadian society, programs
4 which are educational and informational, especially
5 those which provide practical information to assist the
6 orientation and integration of immigrants in Canadian
7 society.
8 473 Types C and D programs are rare among
9 the ethnic programs which target Chinese Canadian
10 communities. Such programs are important as they
11 foster cultural heritage and provide a sense of
12 community and identity, especially among those who are
13 second, third or fourth generation Chinese Canadians,
14 those who have not fully retained the use of the
15 Chinese language.
16 474 Type E programs are very minimal in
17 both mainstream and ethnic broadcasting stations,
18 although they are important in promoting
19 multiculturalism and cross-cultural and inter-cultural
20 understanding among the Canadian population as a whole.
21 475 Finally, I am going to address
22 anti-discriminatory programming. The content of ethnic
23 programs is at times discriminatory. It is racist,
24 sexist and homophobic and discriminates against those
25 with disabilities. Commentators are often ill-equipped
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1 to provide bias-free and neutral information and there
2 is not a balance of different viewpoints.
3 476 Currently, the CRTC does not have an
4 effective monitoring and complaint system in place for
5 ethnic broadcast.
6 477 Based on the above submission we have
7 several recommendations. First, an increased
8 commitment in governmental support and funding to
9 ethnic programming, more specifically, in the
10 improvement of accessibility to services, and in the
11 development of informational, educational and
12 cross-cultural programming, as the private sector
13 cannot be depended on to meet the needs of ethnic
14 communities.
15 478 Second, clear guidelines on the
16 specific types of Canadian content programs broadcast
17 by ethnic stations, to ensure diversity and that the
18 needs of various Chinese Canadian communities are being
19 met.
20 479 Third, guidelines on minimum
21 requirements of Type C, D and E programs for both
22 ethnic and mainstream stations.
23 480 Fourth, expanding the provision of
24 and access to Type C, D and E programs -- for example,
25 through time slots on mainstream stations, individual
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1 production of programs to be broadcast on local
2 information channels such as TVO, establishment of
3 community channels similar to Rogers Cable 10 in
4 Toronto. The latter can also be used to offer Type A
5 programs in smaller cities.
6 481 Fifth, a full consultation with
7 different communities across Canada on the vision of a
8 national ethnic television network -- on the preferable
9 and feasible options and strategies to establish such a
10 network.
11 482 Sixth, compulsory training in
12 cross-cultural sensitivity and anti-discrimination for
13 both ethnic and mainstream broadcasters, especially
14 their front line staff, for example, commentators and
15 journalists.
16 483 Seventh, the establishment of ethnic
17 specific advisory groups to monitor and advise the CRTC
18 on ethnic programming.
19 484 Eighth, commitment, guidelines and
20 policies on the non-discriminatory and
21 non-stereotypical representation of Chinese and other
22 visible minorities in the media that is reflective of
23 the make-up of the Canadian society. Such commitment,
24 guidelines and policies should address both on the
25 screen and behind the scene representation. Ethnic
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1 programming is not the solution to the lack of
2 diversity in the mainstream media.
3 485 Thank you very much.
4 486 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much
5 for your comments, Mr. Ma and Ms Jong.
6 487 I wonder if I could just ask you a
7 couple of questions of clarification and I believe
8 Commissioner Langford has a question or two for you as
9 well.
10 488 On the second page of your
11 presentation under "Accessibility to Services" you that
12 community channels which can carry ethnic programming
13 have been sold off to specialty channels, such as the
14 golf channel. I am just wondering what you mean by
15 that. That's not a phenomenon that I am familiar with.
16 489 MR. MA: What we know of is that in
17 some communities that used to have community channels,
18 like Channel 10 in most cases, the number of those
19 channels has been decreasing and we know that sometimes
20 they were sold in order to -- the broadcaster has sold
21 them in order to provide another specialty channel or
22 pay channel, like the golf channel.
23 490 THE CHAIRPERSON: So you mean the
24 channel was dropped -- the community channel was
25 dropped?
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1 491 MR. MA: Uh-huh.
2 492 THE CHAIRPERSON: Okay. Because
3 typically the specialty channels are not carried on
4 basic. Golf, for example, I think is available only on
5 a discretionary basis and the community channels I
6 believe are basic channels. But I would be interested
7 in finding out from you where you think that has
8 happened.
9 493 MR. MA: We would be pleased to
10 provide you more information later on.
11 494 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.
12 495 In your recommendations -- your first
13 recommendation says that you recommend:
14 "an increased commitment in
15 governmental support and funding
16 to ethnic programming, more
17 specifically, in the improvement
18 of accessibility to services,
19 and in the development of
20 informational, educational and
21 cross-cultural programming, as
22 the private sector cannot be
23 depended on to meet the needs of
24 ethnic communities."
25 496 Who do you suggest should undertake
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1 that?
2 497 MR. MA: Well, this is something I
3 think we need to explore. I think the phenomena of
4 having a community channel sold off to specialty
5 channels is one of the things that can be prevented if
6 there is more funding.
7 498 Also, I think that if -- sometimes
8 also if the community channel does not have enough
9 programs because they don't offer a lot or there is not
10 enough programs that are supplied to this station. So,
11 it is a reflection of the fact that there is not
12 support for Canadian-made production.
13 499 THE CHAIRPERSON: So, would you see
14 the community channels filling that role, more than a
15 traditional or conventional broadcaster or the public
16 broadcaster, for example?
17 500 MR. MA: I think it is one of the
18 ways that these needs can be met and I think the
19 traditional broadcaster can have also their share of
20 responsibility as well.
21 501 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.
22 502 That actually takes me to my next and
23 final question, recommendation No. 5, which is:
24 "a full consultation with
25 different communities across
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1 Canada on the vision of a
2 national ethnic television
3 network -- on the preferable and
4 feasible options and strategies
5 to establish such a network;"
6 503 We had a presenter yesterday who
7 suggested that the time has passed for a conventional
8 national ethnic network and that this is an area that
9 needs to be served by specialty channels, whether they
10 are single community specialty channels or a group of
11 communities, such as the group of communities that have
12 come together from South Asia or the Asian Television
13 Network. I am wondering about your response to that
14 suggestion that the time has passed for a national
15 ethnic network?
16 504 MR. MA: I think the idea of an
17 national ethnic network is very important in the sense
18 that specialty channels run on the market force. If
19 there is a profit to be made from that market the
20 service will be provided. So when we look at the
21 demographics in our community, a large percentage are
22 concentrated in cities such as Toronto and Vancouver
23 which are adequately served I think. There are still
24 areas in terms of programming that can be improved, but
25 I think that what is really lacking is people, for
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1 example, who live in Halifax or Saskatoon where there
2 is only about 5,000 people of Chinese origin. How can
3 they have access to a specialty channel to serve them,
4 unless they buy a satellite dish and pay a certain fee.
5 Even then you have to have an agreement with the local
6 broadcaster.
7 505 So, we are talking about if there is
8 an ethnic broadcast network, these smaller communities
9 may have better access to this third language or ethnic
10 programming than just a structure which should rely on
11 the market force.
12 506 THE CHAIRPERSON: And would you see
13 that network being carried on basic?
14 507 MR. MA: I don't know enough to
15 respond to that. Oh, you mean as a basic channel?
16 508 THE CHAIRPERSON: On basic cable
17 television or basic DTH or basic MDS, so that it is
18 available to the largest number of subscribers. There
19 are some actually who would argue that tier 1 has
20 really not become much of a discretionary or is not a
21 discretionary tier any more, since 90 per cent of the
22 subscribers generally subscriber to tier 1. So it is
23 just sort of like an extended basic.
24 509 MS JONG: I guess that would depend
25 on how accessible it would be for other communities.
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1 The basic principle is to provide like increased access
2 to people and if it is not included in basic and people
3 can have access by paying a very minimal fee, I think
4 it would be viable.
5 510 But if it becomes another sort of
6 specialty channel where people have to pay a
7 subscription fee, then we are sort of in one way like
8 defeating the purpose because we are hoping to sort of
9 have these kind of services available to as many people
10 as possible, regardless of resources.
11 511 THE CHAIRPERSON: Mr. Ma, you
12 appeared at the Canadian Television Policy Review last
13 fall. I wonder if you have been following the
14 development of digital television and if you think that
15 the development of digital television and the increased
16 number of channels will assist your cause in some way
17 in terms of making channel capacity available for more
18 third language programming services/
19 512 MR. MA: No. I haven't followed very
20 closely on that, but I heard it is coming and we hope
21 that this will increase accessibility to service.
22 513 Once again, I guess I echo what Ms
23 Jong was saying. I guess they do have to look at how
24 it is going to be provided, if it's a small fee or if
25 it is something that would not prevent most people to
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1 access that, then I think that would be a welcome
2 change.
3 514 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.
4 515 I will turn you over to Commissioner
5 Langford.
6 516 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: I don't want
7 to drag this out, but there was part of your comments
8 about racist and sexism and homophobia and a need for a
9 more perhaps complete complaint system, monitoring
10 system which you call on the CRTC to put in place. I
11 don't know if it will surprise you or anyone in this
12 room, but there are some people who think that we get
13 too much involved at the CRTC and that we
14 over-regulate. There are as many people I think who
15 would ask us to keep our hands out as would ask us to
16 put our hands in and we do have some fairly strong
17 policies in the CRTC in place about these very issues.
18 517 I just wonder whether it might be
19 something that those in your communities could take on
20 yourselves. Perhaps we could play a role in steering
21 complaints your way, but sometimes I think it kind
22 of -- I don't want you to think I have got a closed
23 mind on this, but sometimes a joint venture here
24 between us, a strategic alliance perhaps. You people
25 could do the code and you people could do the
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1 monitoring and we could in a way assist in some way.
2 Do you really want to hand the whole thing over to the
3 CRTC?
4 518 MR. MA: No. I think we are talking
5 about just more of a guideline and also more of an
6 emphasis in this. I think in the past I guess 10 or 15
7 years we have been putting a lot of emphasis on
8 monitoring the mainstream and how they have been
9 reporting on minorities and women and other minorities.
10 519 Even with that I think we still are
11 having, for example, this last couple of days we are
12 getting a lot of calls from the media about the
13 situation of four women who were being smuggled into
14 the States. We are saying why are we asked these
15 questions? We don't really know so much about this and
16 just because they are Chinese that's the only thing.
17 If they happened to be another group, but why do we
18 have a monopoly on this story.
19 520 I think the whole racialization of
20 certain -- I wouldn't want to say crime, but certain
21 activities is still very prevalent in the media. I
22 know the black community has been making a lot of
23 complaints about that and I think the Asian community
24 has its fair share of being racialized and associated
25 with certain crimes.
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1 521 So even with the mainstream we still
2 have a lot of problems even with all this monitoring
3 and complaint process being in place. I guess we have
4 another hearing coming up on the self-regulatory
5 process and how effective it has been. I think we
6 agree with you that it is the best process to start
7 initiating some kind of a joint process to work on
8 this. I think there has not been a lot of emphasis on
9 this issue of the ethnic and third language
10 programming. Sometimes it just totally unconscious.
11 So, in concept maybe it is a question of not being
12 totally aware of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms and
13 maybe it is a question of not having thought through
14 the process, gone through this process.
15 522 So we are not saying that the ethnic
16 language program is particularly sexist or homophobic,
17 but I think it exists in society and everyone is
18 affected. If we have a process for the mainstream, why
19 don't we have a process for the ethnic and third
20 language broadcasting as well.
21 523 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Mr. Ma
22 and Ms Jong.
23 524 Madam Secretary.
24 525 MS RHÉAUME: The next presentation is
25 by Mr. Emmanuel Dick, President of Canadian
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1 Ethnocultural Council.
2 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
3 526 MR. DICK: Thank you, Madam Chair.
4 527 Commissioners, ladies and gentlemen.
5 The CEC is a national umbrella organization, consisting
6 of 31 national groups across the country. Last
7 weekend, 25 presidents of these organizations met and
8 today I would like to present you with a summary of
9 some of these concerns. Should you have questions that
10 follow after my short presentation, it is my hope that
11 some of our member organizations sitting around the
12 table will assist in clarifying any issues which you
13 may question.
14 528 Since its inception in 1980, the CEC
15 has represented a cross-section of ethnocultural groups
16 across Canada. We are a non-profit organization. We
17 are a non-partisan coalition and we are mandated to
18 preserve a united Canada and to remove barriers that
19 prevent some Canadians from participating fully and
20 equally in society.
21 529 The Canadian Ethnocultural Council
22 has made a number of presentations to the CRTC, to
23 federal standing committees and to legislative
24 committees regarding ethnocultural groups in Canada.
25 We appreciate the opportunity to speak to you again on
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1 the importance of multicultural and multilingual
2 diversity or, as the CRTC calls this consultation,
3 third language and ethnocultural programming in Canada.
4 530 The CEC wishes to make clear that
5 Canada's demographic reality must be acknowledge and
6 that mechanisms are put into place which embrace the
7 Multicultural Act, section 27 of the Charter of Rights
8 and Freedoms. Multiculturalism is stated as a
9 fundamental characteristic of Canada and must be
10 included in broadcasting.
11 531 The Ethnocultural Council is very
12 interested in having the CRTC modify or reinforce these
13 following areas within the context of third language
14 and ethnocultural programming:
15 532 One, ensuring accessibility for
16 ethnocultural communities across Canada, reflection of
17 multicultural diversity in Canadian programming,
18 inclusion of Canadian content and addressing gaps int
19 he domestic and international ethnic broadcasting
20 markets.
21 533 Linguistic and ethnic diversity in
22 broadcasting is an important tool for realizing
23 Canada's commitment to a dynamic and multicultural
24 population. The principles entrenched in the
25 Multiculturalism Act must be respected by all
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1 broadcasters. Canada has so fiercely adhered to its
2 official language policy, but it has not been as
3 enthusiastic in its support for multiculturalism,
4 including multilingual and multicultural productions.
5 534 Third language and ethnocultural
6 productions do not have access to the type of funding
7 sources allotted to French or English-language
8 programming. Often third language and ethnic
9 broadcasting lack adequate support or adequate
10 broadcast technology.
11 535 Reinforcing strong ethnic and third
12 language programming in Canada could open new
13 opportunities to expand the Canadian presence abroad
14 and could be the beginning of a media industry with a
15 great deal of potential. This is a source which has
16 the capacity to evolve in a source of price for all
17 Canadians and which, with nurturing from the CRTC,
18 would increase in importance.
19 536 Since the CRTC ethnic broadcasting
20 policy was enacted in 1985, StatsCanada has reported a
21 steady increase in the number of immigrants who have a
22 language other than English or French as their primary
23 language. As home to 42 per cent of Canada's visible
24 minority population, Toronto is estimated to attract
25 over 70,000 immigrants a year.
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1 537 Given our changing global and
2 domestic communities, the value of ethnocultural and
3 third-language broadcasting is even more important than
4 it was when the ethnic broadcasting policy was put in
5 place. Ethnocultural and third-language programming
6 created with Canadian values in mind are essential
7 tools for Canadians who want to be involved in the
8 global community. This programming allows some people
9 to consume Canadian news, information and values, while
10 speaking the language of their homeland.
11 538 Other people, this programming
12 provides an opportunity for the development of their
13 education and understanding of a myriad of cultural and
14 linguistic backgrounds.
15 539 The Canadian system of privatization
16 seems to leave many ethnocultural communities very
17 weak. Canada's only policy on funding requires
18 applicants applying for an ethnic programming licence
19 to provide evidence of continued financial commitment.
20 The market for ethnic programming in Canada has become
21 more competitive over the years. In this competitive
22 market, smaller ethnic communities continue to receive
23 fewer and fewer programming services.
24 540 Domestically, the production of
25 ethnocultural programming depends on work done by
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1 independent producers. Economic support from the
2 ethnocultural communities is generated through
3 sponsorship. Any reduction of funding threatens or
4 makes local production impossible.
5 541 Despite the important need for ethnic
6 broadcasting, conventional television has proven to be
7 an inadequate response to the public demand for
8 multicultural programming.
9 542 Barriers that currently limit the
10 distribution of programming between communities must be
11 removed in order for programming to meet markets all
12 across Canada. Community access television needs to be
13 strengthened and reinforced at the local levels. The
14 CRTC must require all cable companies to provide
15 community programming.
16 543 The CRTC has been negligent in
17 ensuring that public broadcasting fully reflect the
18 multicultural, multilingual and diversity of Canada's
19 demographic reality. This is especially so with
20 respect to the CBC English and French-language
21 programming. Mainstream broadcasters do not produce
22 enough Canadian content which promotes intercultural
23 understanding.
24 544 The CRTC should ensure that grants
25 are available to help offset the costs connected with
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1 ethnic programming. The emphasis should be placed on
2 building strong and effective ethnocultural programming
3 on a domestic level to ensure that Canadian values are
4 reflected in content.
5 545 As technology advances, the CRTC must
6 recognize that rates of computer access and computer
7 literacy are not equitable all across the communities.
8 Visible minorities and linguistic minorities are among
9 many groups that will be faced with marginalization as
10 Canadians with access to new technology work to improve
11 their skills. Canada must place its priority on the
12 domestic production of ethnocultural services, rather
13 than relying on the import of foreign services. The
14 development of distinctly Canadian ethnocultural
15 services is crucial in order for Canada to maintain its
16 sovereignty and in order to transmit uniquely Canadian
17 values to linguistic and ethnocultural groups.
18 546 Imported television broadcast,
19 particularly as this relates to international news,
20 information and trades also have a role. These should
21 not be considered to primarily function, but should be
22 balanced with quality Canadian content.
23 547 When our proposal is submitted there
24 will be a fully developed rationale that will follow
25 the recommendations I am about to read and there are a
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1 number of recommendations:
2 548 The CRTC must include; one, the
3 renewal of the commitment it made in 1985 to basic
4 principles entrenched in the broadcasting policy
5 reflecting Canada's cultural and linguistic diversity.
6 It must ensure that mechanisms are put in place which
7 accords these principles appropriate resources and
8 mechanisms for implementation.
9 549 The CRTC must also include the
10 principles entrenched in the Multiculturalism Act
11 should be respected by all broadcasters.
12 550 The CRTC develop certification of
13 Canadian content by the use of scorecard rating
14 systems, whereby the reflection of Canada's
15 multicultural diversity is included as part of the
16 scores for certification.
17 551 A structure governing how necessary
18 resources will be allocated to community-based
19 organizations for research and analysis of the needs of
20 ethnocultural communities and various elements of
21 broadcasting, including the impact on new media.
22 552 A system of funding and grants made
23 available to help finance the production of domestic
24 ethnocultural and third-language programming for
25 domestic and international markets that would allow for
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1 the production of higher budget and higher-quality
2 productions.
3 553 The encouragement of networks that
4 facilitate co-productions between Canadian programmers
5 and their international counterparts.
6 554 An improved broadcast distribution
7 system that would allow the movement of ethnocultural
8 programs between urban centres, but within
9 ethnocultural communities for broadcast and community
10 access channels.
11 555 The definition of community should
12 have both a domestic and an international focus in
13 order to build networks between broadcasters within
14 Canada and abroad.
15 556 It is crucial that Canada's
16 demographic reality be reflected in television, radio
17 and new media programming, both domestically and in
18 programs we export. Ethnic programming is even more
19 important than it was when the broadcasting policy was
20 last reviews.
21 557 This, Madam Chair, is just but a part
22 of a larger submission that will be coming to you very
23 shortly.
24 558 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
25 much, Mr. Dick.
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1 559 I believe Commissioner Langford has a
2 question for you.
3 560 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: I listened
4 with interest to your recommendations and I thank you
5 for the amount of work you have obviously put into this
6 paper of yours, your presentation.
7 561 One thing confused me a little and it
8 may be that I just didn't hear it correctly and I
9 wonder if you could clarify it for me. You call at one
10 point for -- I think you did, I don't want to put words
11 in your mouth, but my notes seem to say you called for
12 a return to kind of stronger community channels and at
13 the same time you are calling for more production, more
14 Canadian production of programming. You will know, of
15 course, or you may know that there has been a movement
16 away from community channels towards putting money into
17 Canadian production funds. Are you calling for kind of
18 a move back to the community or a balance of both or
19 have I just misunderstood you?
20 562 MR. DICK: I am consulting my
21 colleagues who were at the meeting on the weekend. I
22 think they want to move towards a more balanced.
23 563 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: So room for
24 both we think?
25 564 MR. DICK: Yes.
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1 565 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: Thank you
2 very much.
3 566 Maybe when you are putting your final
4 submission in by March 4 you could take another look at
5 that for me. I just want to make sure I am clear on
6 it.
7 567 MR. DICK: Okay. Thanks very much.
8 568 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: Thank you
9 very much.
10 569 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
11 much, Mr. Dick.
12 570 MS RHÉAUME: The next presentation is
13 by Mr. Hasanat Ahmad Syed, Executive Director of the
14 Ethnic Council of Arts.
15 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
16 571 MR. SYED: Good afternoon, Madam
17 Chair and members of the CRTC.
18 572 I thank the members of the CRTC for
19 giving me an opportunity to make a presentation on a
20 very important subject. The CRTC is to be complimented
21 for having undertaken this review of its current policy
22 respecting third language and ethnic programming.
23 573 As indicated by the CRTC, it was in
24 1985 when it evolved a broadcasting policy reflecting
25 Canada's cultural and linguistic diversity.
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1 574 Truly, much has changed. The face of
2 Canada is changing fast, especially of Toronto which in
3 a couple of years would have a preponderance of a
4 population whose mother tongue would neither be English
5 nor French. it does call for urgent and immediate
6 measures.
7 575 To the first question: To what
8 extent -- to the first question of the CRTC -- To what
9 extent does the present broadcasting system adequately
10 serve Canada's ethnocultural communities system? The
11 answer is simple; it does not. The question of the
12 extent does not arise. There is a total disdain and
13 contempt displayed by the network towards third
14 language and ethnic programming.
15 576 We do not go across the country. We
16 would only take the example of Toronto, where more than
17 10 per cent of Canada's entire population lives and of
18 which more than half comprises of the various ethnic
19 communities.
20 577 Taking again only the TV networks,
21 CBC, CTV, Global, City-TV, TV Ontario and a host of
22 other small networks, their programming schedule reveal
23 a dismal picture and the worst culprits among them are
24 those networks which are paid out of the taxpayers
25 money and a chunk of that money come from the pockets
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1 of the ethnic communities. The management of the CBC
2 and TV Ontario have some explaining to do. Why on a
3 consistent basis they are ignoring the legitimate needs
4 and aspirations of an audience from whom they are
5 getting million of dollars?
6 578 The CRTC has a role to play in this
7 area. It is time when they come before the CRTC for
8 the renewal of their licences that the CRTC can
9 question them: What is their performance in this area?
10 579 I have appeared before this body in
11 the past when the licence for the renewal of the CBC
12 came up and when Mr. Keith (sic) was the Chair. He did
13 take notice, but in the absence of an ongoing
14 monitoring system, all assurances lapsed in oblivion.
15 580 Such reviews are only good if there
16 is a follow-up action. These hearings in themselves
17 are good only if there is a concrete and firm
18 enunciation of a policy that responds to the changing
19 needs of the time.
20 581 In addition to third-language
21 broadcasts, ethnic programming demands a serious
22 attention. We welcome an over-zealous coverage of
23 Christmas and the last two weeks of the months of
24 December ethnic Canadians listen to nothing but
25 Christmas shopping, Christmas festivities, Christmas
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1 carols and the whole of Canada is engulfed in it. The
2 Canadians came only to know about the beginning of
3 Ramadhan when USA and Britain started air strikes on
4 Baghdad.
5 582 Canadians know very little what
6 Ramadhan is. About half a million Canadians are
7 Muslims and then very little is known what Eid ul Fitr
8 is, which to Muslims is more important than Christmas,
9 and yet no network carried any program about the
10 significance of Ramadhan or the feast that follows it.
11 583 Canadian Muslims feel that they live
12 in a foreign land, even though we are proud of being
13 Canadian, but the Canadians are not proud of us. The
14 same thing can be said about the festivals of Jews,
15 hindus, Budhs, Sikhs and others.
16 584 Coming to the second question of the
17 CRTC: Given the demographic changes that have taken
18 place in Canada how can the needs and interests of
19 ethnocultural communities continue to be served?
20 585 The question sounds interesting,
21 continue to be served. It presupposes that needs of
22 the ethnocultural are served. There is no such things
23 as their needs are served.
24 586 While the CRTC acknowledges the
25 demographic changes, it is unfortunate that they
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1 believe their needs are being served. That is not the
2 situation.
3 587 Again, we take the example of Toronto
4 which has a preponderance of a population which is
5 neither English nor French, then why 95 per cent of the
6 content of the broadcasts are English? And why the
7 networks like CBC and TV Ontario which are getting
8 millions of dollars from the pockets of the ethnic
9 communities do not devote even 10 per cent of their
10 broadcast in third languages or ethnic programming?
11 588 Here the CRTC has a role to play. It
12 is you who renew their licences without asking them
13 whether they are discharging their obligations towards
14 their audiences. The CRTC has to develop a strong
15 monitoring system. These hearings do not carry much
16 force if the policy evolved by the CRTC decorate their
17 own archives.
18 589 The best yardstick, at least for
19 Toronto, is the examination and assessment of the
20 relative strength of Canadians of Chinese, South Asian
21 origin and based on their figures the time slot at
22 least on the public broadcasting system which heavily
23 draws upon the revenues from the ethnic communities be
24 crafted. We are not asking for time allocation of 50
25 per cent, which is justified by the strength of the
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1 population that lives in Toronto, but a reasonable
2 beginning. A recognition of the fact that these ethnic
3 communities do exist and their needs are to be served
4 in a fashion that is both democratic and sensible.
5 This applies to both public and private broadcasting
6 networks and that is only possible if the CRTC asks for
7 iron clad guarantees from these networks when they come
8 up before the CRTC for the renewal of their licences.
9 590 Another step that the CRTC can take
10 is to issue at least two or three more licences for
11 independent networks which exclusively cater to the
12 ethnic needs.
13 591 Coming to the third question: Should
14 there be a priority on the development of ethnocultural
15 services than importing foreign services/
16 592 It is an ideal situation. If we can
17 attach priority to their development, but then the
18 question is of the funds. We have the Canada Council
19 which is as narrow minded as broadcasting networks are.
20 They don't feel obliged to fund ethnic initiatives.
21 There is another organization which is living in the
22 past and refuses to recognize the changing face of
23 Canada. if the CRTC can compel the broadcasters to
24 fund such development projects it would be an ideal
25 situation.
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1 593 The importing of foreign services
2 cannot be dispensed with. Such services, however
3 foreign they may be, they do serve a purpose. Till the
4 time indigenous services are developed, and ethnic
5 talent is fully flowered, we have to import such
6 programming.
7 594 As we have indicated, the development
8 of services here in Canada by ethnic talent is a most
9 welcome move, but can the CRTC provide funds? No. It
10 has no funds, nor can it compel the Canada Council or
11 private or broadcasters to make funds available for
12 such ventures. it simply cannot put a ban on foreign
13 services.
14 595 Before I close my presentation, I
15 must lay a great deal of emphasis on developing a
16 mechanism which keeps a constant watch on the needs of
17 third language and ethnic programming, otherwise these
18 hearings carry no meanings and nothing would come out
19 of these hearings.
20 596 It would be a good idea if the CRTC
21 set up an advisory panel of ethnic journalists and
22 artists who can be the ears and eyes of the CRTC. I
23 have spent more than 20 years in broadcasting in my
24 home country and I am prepared to serve on such a
25 panel.
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1 597 One of two recommendations that I
2 have and I want to present before the CRTC is that
3 there has to be a constant monitoring system. You see,
4 we are meeting after 15 years to develop a system over
5 which we have not any control. If we have a regular
6 monitoring system, then it can meet the ethnic needs.
7 598 The second is that the CRTC has to be
8 a little more generous in granting licences for
9 channels which can only and exclusively serve the
10 visible minorities. Only one channel, that is Asian
11 Television Network, I don't know how they got this
12 licence. It is a miracle, because the CRTC is -- I am
13 sorry to say -- is a very close-minded organization.
14 There are specialty channels, there is a golf channel,
15 a life channel, but there is no channel intended for
16 the visible minorities. That is something that is not
17 acceptable.
18 599 Thank you very much.
19 600 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
20 much, Mr. Syed. You will be happy to know there are
21 now nine new Commissioners that have joined within the
22 last year. Maybe that will have some effect on how
23 open minded you believe the institution is.
24 601 I have one questions for you. You
25 made a comment about allowing foreign services in,
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1 authorizing foreign services for carriage to serve
2 various ethnocultural groups until the domestic
3 services have a chance to flourish. It has been argued
4 at various proceedings before us that as soon as you
5 authorize a foreign service to be carried you preclude
6 the ability of a Canadian to start such a service
7 because that service comes in and gets launched and
8 attracts an audience and the market is so small in
9 Canada that it can only support one channel in any
10 particular niche, and sometimes, as in the case of ATN
11 you have, you know, a group of communities, ethnic
12 communities who come together to do programming on one
13 network.
14 602 What would your response be to that?
15 I am just curious. Would you take the foreign service
16 off once people have become attached to it/
17 603 MR. SYED: I do understand the
18 significance of your question and I do agree with the
19 premise. The thing is the CRTC -- or there is no other
20 organization which can fund the local talent. The
21 local talent cannot jump out of its own. There has to
22 be some support. The CRTC has no funds, nor does any
23 other body.
24 604 ATN people -- I don't know --
25 Chandrasekar has done personally with his own money the
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1 thing that he is doing, but the thing is that visible
2 minorities being what they are, I mean 10 per cent,
3 there has to be some way where the local talent has to
4 develop and they cannot just pop out itself unless the
5 funding is there.
6 605 There is no organization in Canada
7 which provides any funding to any ethnic community at
8 all. You go to the Canada Council of Arts and they
9 simply are interested in dances and all that stuff. I
10 mean there is nothing wrong with that, but the thing is
11 that they have to take into consideration the changing
12 demographic of Canada. They simply close their eyes.
13 606 The Canada Council spent last year
14 $55 million in Ontario alone. If you ask them how much
15 they have spent on the ethnic communities they simply
16 have no answer for that.
17 607 The thing is that your hands are
18 limited. I mean, you simply regulate this particular
19 industry and it is in the regulation of this industry
20 that you can wield power. The thing is that if these
21 networks come and you say, look, there is a changing
22 face of Canada and you have to pay attention to it.
23 You do -- we, in any case, watch the CBC and all of
24 us -- the thing is that what we see is nothing of our
25 interest.
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1 608 We do watch news. The thing is that
2 there is so many programs which are intended for -- I
3 mean there is nothing wrong with that, but they have to
4 take into consideration the other things. We are
5 paying money. The money that we pay goes to the CBC as
6 well and that is the thing.
7 609 So, my suggestion is that the CRTC
8 has only stick and that stick is of the renewal of the
9 licences. They can only say, look here, this is the
10 thing. We are having pressure. We see there is a
11 changing face in Canada and you have to take notice of
12 it.
13 610 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
14 much.
15 611 Commissioner Langford.
16 612 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: I will try to
17 be brief because I don't want to slow other people
18 down, but a couple of things that you said caught my
19 interest, one Martha has already addressed, but a
20 couple of others.
21 613 With regard to renewal of licences,
22 like the CBC and CTV. Coincidentally, they are coming
23 up for renewal this year, so I am interested in your
24 comments obviously. But I wonder how you address this
25 sort of a problem, that though Toronto is a large part
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1 of the Canadian reality, it is not the only part of the
2 Canadian reality and the CBC is trying to program for
3 the whole Canadian reality. I don't want to appear to
4 be an apologist for the CBC, but I just want to try to
5 state the other side of the coin.
6 614 So that if they are programming for
7 Yellowknife or Halifax or Tuktoyaktuk or Edmonton, they
8 may be looking at a completely different demographic
9 mix than Toronto. Are you suggesting that the CRTC
10 make specific ethnocultural licensing conditions that
11 would reflect the Toronto reality, but in a sense not
12 reflect other parts of Canada? How do we deal with
13 that balancing problem?
14 615 MR. SYED: It is not a question of
15 Toronto. What about Vancouver? Vancouver has a very
16 large population of Asians. There are a number of
17 pockets where the thing is --
18 616 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: But I am
19 saying what about Canada?
20 617 MR. SYED: The thing is the CBC is
21 programming on a national level. You may be probably
22 right because of 90 per cent, but when they are coming
23 to Ontario they have to entirely change that complex
24 because they are catering to a population of which half
25 of which does not speak English and French.
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1 618 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: So would you
2 make them -- I am not trying to interrupt, but I am
3 just trying to speed this along a little because there
4 are so many people, but would you make then a clear
5 delineation between local CBC program, which they have
6 a local CBC station here, and national CBC programming?
7 Is that really what we are going for here?
8 619 MR. SYED: Probably that will serve
9 the purpose, if local CBC programming -- even that
10 doesn't do anything at all. If you watch local CBC
11 programming, not even 10 per cent of the ethnic or
12 third language is there. I mean it is entirely devoted
13 to one angle, one slant.
14 620 So, if you want to confine CBC
15 national and CBC regional, then of course we will go
16 for -- and CBC Ontario and they provide us a chunk of
17 time which should be reflected by the demographic
18 fields.
19 621 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: Thanks very
20 much.
21 622 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much
22 for being with us.
23 623 MS RHÉAUME: The next presenter is
24 Mr. Ajit Jain, Secretary for the South Asian
25 Journalists' Club.
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1 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
2 624 MR. JAIN: Good afternoon, Madam
3 Chairperson and also the Commissioner, fellow
4 professional journalists and experts here.
5 625 As the first speaker mentioned about
6 Asian Television Network and the discussion also
7 started with my previous speaker, I do agree with both
8 speakers that it is futile on the part of the CRTC to
9 give a specialty licence to Asian Television Network
10 and not ensure that the cable companies comply -- that
11 they have a licence and the cable companies co-operate
12 and give them the channel. So, two years have passed
13 and the programs are coming along, you require a dish
14 and you pay "x" amount of money. The result is the
15 viewers are not there. The viewers are not there
16 because you have to first buy a dish. You have to
17 install a dish and it takes so much effort and many
18 people say they don't know whether the program is going
19 to continue or not. So the cable companies have to be
20 advised to co-operate.
21 626 But the opening thing for me, this
22 kind of review, as has been mentioned, it is important
23 to get input from all across the country, from
24 different professional organizations, experts in the
25 broadcasting field and others. This should not be a
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1 one-time review, as has been mentioned earlier. This
2 is very significant. It has to be monitored because
3 the situation in the country is constantly changing and
4 I will have to, even for the sake of repetition it has
5 been mentioned about statistics, census figures, that
6 around 200,000 people are being admitted into the
7 country on an annual basis, an ongoing basis and come
8 in different categories, independent immigrants,
9 professionals, people under the family reunification
10 clause and also business people who come here to make
11 investments. They are admitted as investors. They
12 bring different types of experiences, their different
13 cultural and ethno background, different religions.
14 627 Seventy-thousand people come to this
15 city alone and all the beautiful faces come each year
16 to this city alone. Now, they don't look alike. They
17 look different because they come from different
18 countries and they come from different backgrounds.
19 Their needs are completely different. Many of them
20 don't speak a word of English. They don't speak a word
21 of French. It doesn't mean they are illiterate. They
22 bring a wealth of experience and it is because of their
23 experience. It is because of their qualifications. It
24 is because of their degrees they have from third
25 countries that Canada Immigration allows them to come
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1 to this country.
2 628 Once they come here what do we do
3 about their needs? The 1996 census was mentioned
4 earlier and here I have the figures. There about 3.2
5 million visible minority people in the country and of
6 these 700,000 are South Asians. I represent at least
7 those 700,000 as my friend to my left does. In Toronto
8 alone there are 353,000 South Asians and a population
9 of known French, known English-speaking people are
10 projected by demographers to exceed to 54 per cent by
11 the end of the century. It is just one year, barely
12 one year.
13 629 So our suggestion, I am talking on
14 behalf of the South Asian Journalists' Club, the South
15 Asian journalists as a whole, that this kind of review
16 of the broadcasting policy should be an ongoing
17 exercise, a regular exercise to get input from people
18 at large to regularly review the needs of the new
19 immigrants and also to ascertain reactions of
20 Canadians, Canadians at large.
21 630 There is no doubt of expertise in the
22 country. Expertise is not confined. After all, CBC,
23 TV Ontario, as was mentioned earlier, are being
24 financed by the Canadian taxpayers, by him and me and
25 you alike, so these organizations at least have to meet
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1 the needs of the larger population, a population
2 comprising of different religions, different ethnic
3 groups, different cultural groups and that is not
4 happening, most unfortunately.
5 631 Whether the CBC should be following,
6 as the Commissioner asked, a country-wide policy or
7 confined to a local pocket, what about the local
8 programming? The question was asked, you see. If they
9 are thinking of the entire Canadian policy and the
10 Canadian population, the Canadian population normally
11 comprises of 100 per cent French speaking, 100 per cent
12 WASP, but the population has changed and this factor,
13 this important factor cannot be ignored. The viewers
14 have changed. What about the needs of these viewers?
15 632 Coming now to the needs of our group,
16 that is the South Asian population, you, friends,
17 sitting on the board, members of the CRTC, should know
18 that in India -- I have to mention that -- there are 19
19 different languages and 353,000 people who live in
20 Toronto alone speak these 19 different languages. I am
21 not expecting the CBC or TV Ontario to start
22 programming in 19 different languages, but here is the
23 Asian Television Network which was mentioned, a
24 specialty channel and they got a licence so that they
25 could present programming in 19 different languages.
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1 633 Predominantly, I will take out of
2 those 19 different languages those who are here and
3 speak Punjabi, Busarati (ph) and Hindi. These are
4 three major languages. In Pakistan, a neighbouring
5 country of India, they speak Urdu as their main
6 language. In Bangladesh, another neighbouring country,
7 and these people are here in a large number, they speak
8 Urdu and Bengali. Immigrants from Sri Lanka, another
9 South Asian country, speak two major languages, Tamil
10 and Sinhalese. Immigrants from Nepal speak Nepalese
11 and Hindu.
12 634 In your current exercise you have to
13 bear this fact in mind that there is an important
14 segment of the Canadian population who speak all these
15 languages, but many of them also speak English
16 fluently. I never said they don't speak English. They
17 are here.
18 635 There are immigrants who are admitted
19 under the Family Reunification clause which is very
20 important, largely seniors, and they don't speak
21 English or French. They speak Hindi, Punjabi, Tamil
22 and Urdu. These people are emotionally attached to
23 their respective religions as any new immigrant. Many
24 of them are Sikhs, Hindus, Buddhists or followers of
25 Islam like my friend. How this diversity -- it is very
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1 important -- is reflected in the CRTC policies simply
2 reviews, simply asking questions, satisfies their
3 needs.
4 636 People have written, people have made
5 telephone calls. They have made representations,
6 letters to the editor have appeared. People have met
7 Perrin Beatty, a friend of this friend, and his
8 predecessors from the CBC, but the policies don't seem
9 to have changed. The CBC's attitude hasn't changed at
10 all. The CBC thinks the country is what it was 20
11 years back and it still continues to be dominated by
12 programming that largely caters to a WASP population or
13 French Canadians.
14 637 How many visible minority faces do we
15 see on the CBC screen at least? How many reporters or
16 producers have they employed from visible minority
17 communities or from South Asians? How many South
18 Asians or visible minority experts are invited for
19 interviews or roundtable discussions on subjects that
20 affect them directly -- South Asians?
21 638 There is an enormous amount of
22 criticism of India currently going on in the mainstream
23 media on the treatment of Christians in some parts of
24 the country -- back in India. The CBC has not taken
25 the trouble when the subject is so insensitive, so
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1 emotional, of inviting some indo-Canadian experts who
2 know what is happening, who know the country, who know
3 the minority groups, either professional journalists,
4 broadcasters, teachers or the students or the regular
5 visitors or the business people who also visit the
6 country or the politicians who visit from India or the
7 South Asian subcontinent here and they have the
8 information.
9 639 People sit at a desk in the CBC
10 building and they take it upon themselves that they are
11 experts in all conceivable subjects or they have their
12 own list of favourites who are invited to discuss any
13 and every subject, most unfortunately, and I consider
14 that and my friends consider that to be very unfair to
15 minority communities. These are harsh words, but they
16 have to be said here.
17 640 So, to answer your first question, as
18 to the extent the present broadcasting system serves
19 Canada's ethnocultural communities, my answer is
20 minimal. There is just no interest to serve the new
21 Canadians, certainly from my home country I will say,
22 from the subcontinent which is part of my home country,
23 South Asia.
24 641 Your second question relates to the
25 demographic changes that have taken place in the
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1 country and how can the needs and interests of
2 ethnocultural communities continue to be served? I
3 stated earlier the existing networks are hardly
4 responding to the needs of ethnocultural communities or
5 their interest. How many Canadians what Devali (ph)
6 is? Devali is Christmas. Devali is New Years for
7 Indians, for Hindus largely.
8 642 How many people know that, as he
9 mentioned, the significance of Ramadhan? This lack of
10 awareness is attributed, frankly, to the lack of
11 interest on the part of the TV networks or the part of
12 radio stations. The community groups, the various
13 Hindu temples organize major festivities in Toronto.
14 They send press release, make telephone calls with out
15 any response.
16 643 They don't know how to write press
17 releases they are told, so you, the CRTC, has to send a
18 directive, if it is within your mandate, I am not sure,
19 to the CBC, CTV. You said they are coming for review,
20 their licence, and this is the question to be asked.
21 This is the information they must provide to the CRTC,
22 that they have to have a time slot for ethnic
23 programming, for programming of different religions to
24 respond to the needs of around 12 per cent of the
25 visible minority population and also for other groups
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1 on behalf of the South Asian media.
2 644 My suggestion is that various TV
3 networks, radio stations, should be advised to set up
4 advisory panels of the ethnic journalists, academics,
5 artists who provide regular input regarding the needs
6 of the respective groups. Similarly, the CRTC itself
7 could have a panel on these lines as part of their
8 ongoing review of their policies.
9 645 Thank you, Commissioners, for
10 listening to me.
11 646 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much
12 for your contribution this afternoon.
13 647 MS RHÉAUME: The next presentation is
14 by Ms Elvira Sanchez de Malicki of the Canadian
15 Hispanic Congress.
16 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
17 648 MS SANCHEZ de MALICKI: Buenos
18 tardes. Muchas gracias. Me nombre es Elvira Sanchez
19 de Malicki. And no, I am not going to speak everything
20 in Spanish, don't worry.
21 649 I am the founding President of the
22 Canadian Hispanic Congress, the national organization
23 which represents more than 700,000 Spanish-speaking
24 people with origins in more than 20 different countries
25 and who now live in Canada. The CHC is a member of the
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1 Canadian Ethnocultural Council and the National
2 organization of Immigrant and Visible Minority Women of
3 Canada, organizations which represent the more than 50
4 per cent of Canada's population which are neither of
5 English, French or native origin.
6 650 I am a director and independent
7 producer involved in Hispanic theatre and television
8 since the early seventies. Most of the work has been
9 done without remuneration. There is not much money in
10 ethnic productions and almost no chance to work in
11 mainstream productions.
12 651 For almost two decades I have been a
13 "card-carrying" member of ACTRA. "Card-carrying" has a
14 different meaning when you only get called for "ethnic"
15 roles, and usually not the most glamorous ones.
16 652 I have served in the Media Committees
17 with the CEC, NOIVMW, the Canada and the ontario
18 Advisory Councils on Multiculturalism and Citizenship.
19 Last July I was appointed to the board of Telefilm
20 Canada. But I am not speaking as a member of Telefilm.
21 They will be making their submission later on to you.
22 653 I will not bring you statistics. I
23 believe all the resources to get all the statistics
24 about Canada's ethnocultural communities and you also
25 should be very much aware of the importance of living
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1 in this global village. I am not going to be ethno
2 specific in my comments, but I am speaking to you as a
3 Canadian citizen who can't accept the fact that the
4 demographic reality of Canada is blatantly absent from
5 our radios, cinemas, television and "new media".
6 654 I am speaking for the millions who
7 can't or won't because they feel utterly helpless and
8 frustrated living in a society that boasts about its
9 human rights, its equality and respect for all, yet,
10 fails to accurately reflect its people. Does the fact
11 that we don't see nor hear them mean that they don't
12 exist? We have numerous acts, laws and regulations in
13 favour of protecting and nurturing Canada's diversity
14 yet, the reality we live is so contrary to the stated
15 ideals.
16 655 We must stop representing ours as a
17 unichrome/unitone society. Because this, we are not.
18 656 Since the broadcast media is the most
19 powerful tool for influencing or educating society, the
20 CRTC must establish now the mechanisms which will help
21 to ensure that the demographic reality of Canada is
22 fairly and equitably reflected in its radio, film,
23 television and new media screens in order to ensure
24 that all Canadians have equal access participation and
25 representation in the economic, political, social and
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1 cultural life of Canada.
2 657 The CRTC should ensure that the
3 Broadcasting Act reflects the demographic reality of
4 Canada, respects the Multiculturalism Act and embraces
5 the Constitution of Canada which states that
6 "multiculturalism is a fundamental characteristic of
7 Canada".
8 658 It is absolutely unacceptable to
9 speak of our multicultural and multiracial reality and
10 omit the obvious multilingual reality. Or are we to
11 perpetuate the Victoria ways that "children must be
12 seen, but not heard?"
13 659 I have typed some proposed changes to
14 the Broadcasting Act. I know that the CRTC doesn't do
15 the changes, but I am sure and trust that after hearing
16 the presentations here today you will bring it to the
17 powers that be and, hopefully, there will be a
18 revision, especially on the issue of the two official
19 languages, which is very discriminatory to a
20 multilingual society.
21 660 When we consider relevant Canadian
22 content it is important to note that not all cable
23 companies are required to provide a community channel
24 and thus, ethnic programming has suffered so that there
25 are less and less opportunities to produce and air
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1 ethnic programming.
2 661 The fact that a Canadian host
3 introduces videos, films or any kind of show which
4 consists of, primarily, imported audiovisual material,
5 and such program is packaged and broadcast in Canada,
6 does not constitute Canadian content. Canadian content
7 should reflect the Canadian point of view in all of its
8 different expressions, be reflective of our demographic
9 reality and be relevant to Canadians.
10 662 Relevant Canadian content should be
11 varied and include programming in all the genres,
12 including information, documentaries, drama, children's
13 programming.
14 663 Mainstream broadcasters do not
15 produce Canadian content which promotes intercultural
16 understanding.
17 664 The whole issue of brokerage by
18 mainstream broadcasters should be reviewed by the CRTC.
19 It allows for a two-tier system of accessibility of our
20 broadcast channels and permits loopholes in Canadian
21 content requirements.
22 665 The CRTC's policies on carriage of
23 ethnic stations and foreign services: The current CRTC
24 policy that 10 per cent of a community must be ethnic
25 origin before service is carried is discriminatory and
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1 must be revised. This policy denies access.
2 666 It is important that audiences decide
3 which discretionary services they are willing to pay
4 for.
5 667 The CRTC has allowed foreign services
6 to be carried by cable companies which is less of a
7 priority than strengthening Canadian ethnic services.
8 668 Regarding community audience input:
9 Licensees of third language and ethnic broadcasting,
10 and basically all licensees, should be sensitive and
11 responsive to the needs and demands of the community
12 they purport to serve.
13 669 Some principles for the Commission to
14 embrace in, and I don't like saying ethnic broadcasting
15 because I believe it should be just Canadian
16 broadcasting.
17 670 Ethnic broadcasting has evolved
18 significantly since 1985 when the CRTC first issued its
19 Policy on Ethnic Broadcasting and should continue to be
20 an integral component of the Canadian broadcasting
21 system.
22 671 I would like to make the following
23 recommendations:
24 672 That the CRTC adopt an integrative
25 approach to its ethnic policy. Semantics are not
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1 important. "Broadcasting Policy Reflecting Canada's
2 Cultural and linguistic Diversity" was a better name
3 and that was what was used 15 years ago. Now having it
4 as "Third Language and Ethnic Broadcasting" is
5 basically pigeonholing it into something that is very
6 unacceptable.
7 673 That the CRTC develops new guidelines
8 for -- and this I want you to please take close note.
9 That the CRTC develops new guidelines for the
10 certification of Canadian content, perhaps by the use
11 of a score-card rating system whereby the reflection of
12 Canada's demographic reality is integral to the
13 certification.
14 674 I find that very often productions
15 which could qualify as Canadian content are
16 disqualified if they are done on a third language and
17 that is not fair. So, I think that the CRTC should
18 look at the certification of Canadian content to make
19 sure that if you are using a score-card system or
20 whatever system at least certain points are given for
21 the reflection of Canada's diversity or points being
22 taken out if it doesn't.
23 675 That all, ethnic as well as
24 mainstream, Canadian broadcasters, including the CBC
25 and Radio-Canada, be encouraged to produce relevant
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1 Canadian content in all genres. It is not fair that
2 our main public broadcaster blatantly ignores our
3 reality.
4 676 That the CRTC review the practice of
5 brokering programming.
6 677 That the CRTC review its current
7 policy on carriage of ethnic broadcasting services. I
8 make this a priority over the additional entry into
9 Canada and carriage by cable companies of more foreign
10 services, especially if we take into consideration the
11 fact that digital compression will enable cable
12 companies to carry many channels.
13 678 That the CRTC make ethnic
14 broadcasters more responsive to the views of audiences
15 and accountable to them.
16 679 That more international
17 co-productions be encouraged.
18 680 That there be support in terms of
19 financing for Canadian ethnic programming to allow, for
20 example, higher budget and quality programming to be
21 produced. It is ridiculous to expect ethnic
22 programming to be produced with no financing. Then
23 they say, "Well, why are we going to put ethnic
24 programming if it is of such low quality?" I mean
25 where is fairness? Where is equity in this country.
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1 681 So, there should be financing
2 available to all ethnic programming and allow the
3 programming to evolve.
4 682 I would like to conclude with a
5 comment that came from a consensus established by other
6 ethnocultural groups.
7 683 One, that ethnic broadcasting in
8 Canada has evolved and it is an important activity to
9 be nurtured by the CRTC.
10 684 Two, there are distinct differences
11 between mere foreign services being available to ethnic
12 Canadians and home grown Canadian ethnic broadcasting.
13 One of the most important differences is Cancon
14 programming.
15 685 Three, there is great need and demand
16 for a national multicultural/multilingual television
17 network to broadcast in basic cable. The CRTC should
18 consider the licensing of such a network as a priority.
19 Why should ethnics always pay for the possibility of
20 receiving service in their languages.
21 686 Four, ethnic Cancon should be just as
22 vibrant and varied as any other Canadian television
23 programming. In fact, there should be more
24 opportunities for international co-production in the
25 case of ethnic programming which by nature often covers
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1 two or more perspectives, like Hispanic Canadians, et
2 cetera.
3 687 Fifth, the Canadian television
4 support programs must also support Canadian ethnic
5 programming so that it can reach its true potential --
6 higher budget documentaries and investigative
7 journalism, dramatic programming.
8 688 Hopefully, the CRTC once it has
9 completed its review of broadcasting in Canada will
10 implement the necessary systems to ensure that concrete
11 programs and changes are made. As I said at the
12 beginning, I have been at this for close to 30 years
13 and not much has changed.
14 689 Thank you.
15 690 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
16 much, Ms. Sanchez de Malicki. I am not going to ask
17 you questions. You have provided a very thorough brief
18 here and thank you for presenting your views to us.
19 691 MS SANCHEZ de MALICKI: Thank you.
20 692 MS RHÉAUME: The next presentation is
21 by Mr. William Marshall, President of PolyMedia, a
22 Division of Cybermedia Inc. If you will introduce the
23 rest of your party, Mr. Marshall.
24 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
25 693 MR. MARSHALL: Thank you.
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1 694 Thank you, Madam Chair,
2 Commissioners, ladies and gentlemen. There are three
3 of us here this evening and to establish our ethnicity
4 I would introduce my colleague Ljubo Milinovic who came
5 to Canada in a very unorthodox manner and a very speedy
6 manner by leaving the former Yugoslavia, and Sari Ruda
7 who came to Canada in a much more restrained and
8 refined manner by leaving England. I myself am a son
9 of Scotland and we understand about separatism and some
10 of the other events that reflect our nation in Canada.
11 I am proud to say that we are the only English-speaking
12 member of the countries that speak English that are
13 everyone else says should have interpreters at all
14 times.
15 695 We are at PolyMedia created to cater
16 to the ethnic marketplace within the broadcast arena.
17 We are exclusive Canadian agents on behalf of foreign
18 broadcasters and we are trying to identify
19 opportunities and promote their services within Canada.
20 696 Our roster of representation is
21 constantly growing as it fulfils its mandate to reach
22 every major group in Canada with the best in original
23 programming from each of those countries. We currently
24 have eight of the number one or number two stations in
25 each country in the world under contract and six more
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1 in negotiation. None of them are in competition with
2 any licensed or planned Canadian ethnic channels that
3 we know of, with the possible exception of ATN and that
4 we have an Indian channel.
5 697 It is our view that the call is not
6 before time that ethnic broadcasting and the new
7 realities of ethnicity in Canada have changed since the
8 1985 policies. We do not believe and we have been told
9 by the communities that we speak to that the goal of
10 making immigrants better Canadians is attainable by the
11 use of television and radio of the existing Canadian
12 production, the CBC or the CTV, as people have been
13 talking about.
14 698 We think that if there are ways to
15 achieve this goal it is through three other ways,
16 education of young children -- children of immigrants,
17 the workplace where immigrants get jobs and you have to
18 speak a mutual language in order to get on, whether you
19 are a financial institution or a high-tech company or
20 working for a cab company. Then the ethnic community
21 organizations which don't just reinforce the home
22 culture and the home language, but the organizations
23 which Canada is very richly endowed with, outreach
24 programs for the ethnic communities to work with the
25 larger Canadian communities. They are also strong
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1 spokespeople for the needs and aspirations of the
2 individual communities.
3 699 Speaking for television only, we
4 think ethnic television has three key roles in Canada.
5 Number one is a link for the ethnic communities because
6 of their homeland and culture, a way to deal with the
7 isolation that some of the other speakers have
8 addressed.
9 700 We see it as an aid to strengthening
10 ethnic community links in major centres of Canada and
11 across Canada, and a strengthening of the knowledge of
12 ethnic heritage, particularly for children of
13 immigrants who are gradually immersed in the large
14 Canadian community.
15 701 Three major shifts have taken place
16 worldwide since the establishment of the CRTC's 1985
17 policy. There has been mammoth growth of television
18 worldwide, with many more countries and many more
19 channels and the growth of delivery systems and private
20 competition for state run broadcast systems which
21 simply didn't exist 15 years ago.
22 702 There is a huge and burgeoning growth
23 in global satellite delivery, allowing countries to
24 export day and date their programming. You no longer
25 have to wait two weeks to see a cricket match or a
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1 formula-one race or a soccer game. You can see it now.
2 703 As other speakers have eloquently
3 pointed out, there has been a dramatic shift in the
4 ethnic immigration to Canada. You have got all the
5 statistics in the world and if we take Toronto alone,
6 with 33 per cent of Toronto residents saying that they
7 use a language other than English or French exclusively
8 in their home, I think it is obvious that the ability
9 to receive television in your home language is crucial
10 to these people.
11 704 We don't see a reason to change
12 multiculturalism as a goal and a useful way to be part
13 of this country for the foreseeable future. In
14 television we see the emphasis shifting to monocultural
15 rather than multicultural and by that I mean in the two
16 stations that you have in Toronto and Montreal there is
17 ethnic programming to be sure, but it is a half an hour
18 a week. I don't know that you can maintain your
19 Macedonian heritage on a half an hour a week or your
20 Somali heritage, but it doesn't seem likely. More and
21 more those channels are looking for ways to make money
22 to stay alive. They have found a way to do that is to
23 rerun American programming. It is creeping up and
24 creeping up and I am sure that when you see the
25 responses that they have in terms of where they get
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1 money from, it is from advertisers looking to audiences
2 who are watching that programming, not necessarily the
3 narrowcasting.
4 705 So we think we should figure out
5 first how to strengthen Canadian ethnic channels and
6 then decide some criteria that would be useful to allow
7 foreign and ethnic channels. Both channels have one
8 problem in common, carriage, access to the airwaves.
9 We think there should be funding for Canadian ethnic
10 programming. We see three ways that this could be done
11 very specifically. One is to take added profits from
12 advertising sales of American and foreign programming
13 on the multicultural channels and make a significant
14 portion of those revenues available to the Canadian
15 ethnic channels for programming purposes.
16 706 Now, the Canadian companies and DTH
17 carriers are selling Canadian ethnic channels at $10
18 and $10 a month to subscribers when they put them on.
19 A healthy proportion of their retained share of that
20 subscription fee should be designated for programming
21 Canadian ethnic channels and that simply isn't being
22 done just now.
23 707 If foreign ethnic channels are
24 licensed, then the same commitment should be made
25 there. A commitment should be made for the foreign
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1 channels to acquire and pay for new programming
2 initiatives that are done by the Canadian ethnic
3 channels. If we are going to find criteria for
4 licensing foreign ethnic channels, we would say that
5 they include at least these three: Proof of major
6 success and penetration in the home country market;
7 proven export value, with a significant track record of
8 acceptance by immigrants in countries around the world,
9 and full compliance with CRTC regulations and a
10 commitment to digital delivery, a la carte pay services
11 to the Canadian subscriber.
12 708 Now, if I can go back for a moment to
13 the problems of carriage that have been mentioned
14 before. I don't go to many CRTC hearings, but when the
15 cable companies come before you these days I don't know
16 how you keep a straight face and don't laugh them out
17 of the room, or else get really mad at them. For 10
18 years they have been promising you, if you would just
19 let us do this, some day we will have digital delivery.
20 If we could just have that, some day you could have
21 digital delivery. Oh, let us spend more money getting
22 the NFL football games on on Sunday and pretty soon
23 we'll have digital delivery for ethnic programming.
24 709 It has never happened. It is never
25 going to happen. The CRTC must make the cable
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1 companies move to digital carriage. They keep saying
2 they can't do it because the equipment doesn't work.
3 710 Well, there are 8 million homes in
4 America magically getting their services from digital
5 boxes. It is not being done by tin cans and a piece of
6 wire. It is being done by the boxes that are available
7 now and they are available in Canada and if you tell
8 them you are going to put them off the air unless they
9 let people have digital delivery, they will be able to
10 get them into Canadian homes as fast as those little
11 trucks can move around the neighbourhoods.
12 711 And another way you could fund
13 digital conversion is to take this secret fund that
14 everybody keeps forgetting about. The cable companies
15 ask for all sorts of congratulations for contributing
16 to the Canadian Television Fund. Well, it's not their
17 money. This was -- years ago 10 per cent was added to
18 everybody's cable bill because the cable systems
19 convinced the CRTC that they needed a 10 per cent
20 surcharge in order to improve equipment. I don't know
21 about yours, but I haven't seen it at my house.
22 712 They got this and then when the
23 deadline came for the ending of this, the deal was made
24 to say, "Well, let's take 5 per cent of that 10 per
25 cent and give that back to programming for Canadian
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1 television," but the other 5 per cent didn't go
2 anywhere. It stays in the pockets of the cable
3 companies.
4 713 They could use that to do digital
5 boxes. They could use that for local ethnic
6 programming. They could do something, but they don't
7 have to keep the money.
8 714 Talking about the foreign ethnic
9 channels again, when we were talking about some of the
10 criteria involved. There is no magic to the number 28
11 per cent, but three or four of the channels that we
12 represent have a market penetration of 20 per cent of
13 the ethnic community in England, Europe and the United
14 States, with subscribers willing almost universally to
15 pay approximately $20 a month for the single channel
16 that they get on top of the basic cable or DTH costs.
17 So there clearly seems to be a reason that people want
18 to do that. The service is needed and it is wanted.
19 715 Operating an a la carte pay service
20 on a digital platform is fine for our clients, but so
21 far that platform is very short and narrow.
22 716 So, we would make six recommendations
23 to make ethnic broadcasting in Canada more relevant to
24 the needs and desires of the immigrant communities.
25 717 The first would be to maintain and
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1 strengthen the ethnic content of the two existing
2 multicultural television channels.
3 718 The second would be to support the
4 newly-licensed Canadian ethnic specialty services and
5 increase their carriage nationally.
6 719 Three would be to allow these
7 Canadian ethnic specialty channels to experiment with
8 regional and national content for their singular ethnic
9 markets and allow the maximum flexibility for them to
10 create Canadian programming in the ethnic languages or
11 English or French as they see fit.
12 720 In terms of financing that kind of
13 programming, we look at at least one of the channels
14 that we represent which in England is spending 35 per
15 cent of its programming dollars in the United Kingdom
16 producing United Kingdom programming for the ethnic
17 channel. I think most of the major channels around the
18 world would have no problem doing that sort of thing.
19 721 We think that the fourth
20 recommendation is to support the licensing of foreign
21 ethnic channels with a proven international audience
22 and with support in Canada.
23 722 Fifth, we would suggest that you
24 encourage in the strongest possible ways cable
25 companies to meet their oft-promised and
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1 under-delivered digital programming commitments.
2 723 Finally, we would encourage digital
3 delivery of ethnic services on DTH and MMDS systems as
4 a condition of licence to match the new delivery
5 systems that will theoretically be installed by the
6 cable companies.
7 724 Thank you very much.
8 725 THE CHAIRPERSON: Commissioner
9 Langford has a couple of questions for you.
10 726 Thank you, Mr. Marshall.
11 727 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: Thanks very
12 much, Mr. Marshall.
13 728 Your colleague, Sari Ruda, who was
14 here last night may have told you that we had some
15 views that weren't quite identical with yours in
16 certain areas. I think the main thrust of what you are
17 saying is generally appreciated, but there were a
18 couple of areas. Mainly in the area of licensing
19 foreign ethnic channels, where other commentators spoke
20 out quite strongly against it.
21 729 Their point, and I always hate to try
22 to take a point just on a 10-minute presentation, but I
23 think it was that if we bring in a foreign ethnic
24 channel we will stifle the incentive for local talent
25 and local production because they just won't be able to
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1 compete. This full blown, as found service will be
2 there, assuming carriage, and for these people working
3 out of their production equivalents of what the
4 propeller heads call the skunk works or whatever, they
5 just won't be able to compete with this. I just wonder
6 how you respond to that problem.
7 730 MR. MARSHALL: Yes. I think we
8 pointed out a couple of ways in which more revenues
9 could be available for local ethnic programming. I
10 think it is true it would be folly to use the Canadian
11 airwaves, a Canadian entity that is owned by all of us
12 sheerly for the profit of outsiders.
13 731 But I think one of the ways in which
14 you could add to the financing that would be available
15 and add to international value of Canadian ethnic
16 talent, and I guess I look to the music industry this
17 way too. As you in the radio business increase
18 Canadian content, then magically the stars that have
19 always been here in Canada got played enough and had
20 enough money to then go to the United States and the
21 world market and become the major stars that they are
22 now.
23 732 I think I have said that some of the
24 channels that we are talking about representing have no
25 problem whatsoever in saying our people around the
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1 world all have relatives, not just in their home
2 country, but in other countries around the world,
3 including Canada. Obviously, we are one of the major
4 basins of immigration. So, why wouldn't it make sense
5 for them to pay for the licensing of Canadian talent
6 and Canadian productions and put it on the air around
7 the world. So, it wouldn't just be something that
8 would help here, but it would help that talent have
9 exposure around the world.
10 733 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: Thanks very
11 much.
12 734 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
13 much, Mr. --
14 735 MS RUDA: May I answer that question
15 as well? I'm sorry, I'm part of the team. Is that all
16 right.
17 736 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: No problem.
18 Carry on.
19 737 MS RUDA: I would just like to say
20 that in the work that we do we involve ourselves very
21 much with the community groups and we liaise all the
22 time with them. We go to their events. We get to know
23 them. I think there is room for the co-existence of
24 both Canadian produced channels -- I mean programming
25 and channels, as well as foreign channels.
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1 738 When we tell them what we are
2 thinking of doing, they say to us, "This is fabulous.
3 We love that channel. We can't wait to get it. Work
4 hard and get it in for us."
5 739 I say, "Well, what about the existing
6 channels?" They say, "Well, that's fine too because
7 that gives us a local perspective, but what we miss is
8 finding out what is happening at home. We want to know
9 what is happening at home. We don't want to live there
10 any more. We like living in Canada, but we need -- we
11 want to be able to touch what goes on."
12 740 So, I think there is room for both
13 things to co-exist, particularly if the foreign
14 channels could be encouraged to perhaps put some of
15 their money into production here, so that there could
16 be some kind of a joint venture in production, that
17 would soften the blow and it would allow for
18 opportunities to go, as Bill said, both sides of the
19 border. So that not only the Canadian talent would
20 merely service the Canadian market, but also be
21 exported.
22 741 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: But we had a
23 gentleman here yesterday who was -- I'm afraid I don't
24 remember his name. He was responsible for putting on
25 one hour of Serbian broadcasting -- you remember that
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1 gentleman -- a week. He talked about the announcements
2 from home and how they worked so hard to put this on.
3 They had no budget. Everybody is a volunteer. He also
4 does the newspaper, this guy, and he makes me feel like
5 I don't work for a living he does so much. How does he
6 compete, for example, and they may be a slightly
7 bizarre example, but if we were to bring in, if we were
8 to license a full Serbian channel? Where does this man
9 go with his hour? I notice that half of the team is
10 not answering.
11 742 MR. MARSHALL: We are in a discussion
12 about components of the former Yugoslavia.
13 743 MS RUDA: We should explain that
14 Ljubo is from Croatia, so we were wondering how to
15 answer that question.
16 744 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: I am just
17 using it as an example. I don't want to get into
18 politics. Please, no politics. This is strictly
19 programming, not politics.
20 745 MR. MARSHALL: All broadcasting is
21 politics.
22 746 The answer to that is I don't know.
23 Is there a big enough audience in Canada for a Serbian
24 channel? If there is, there should be a Serbian
25 channel. If there is enough audience for a sliver of
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1 Serbian programming, then there should be Serbian
2 programs. If Serbians watch the show or other people
3 who are interested in things Serbian watch the show, it
4 will attract this audience and it will survive and
5 prosper.
6 747 If it has no audience and no back-up
7 and no popularity, then it will wither on the vine and
8 I guess that's what happens in everything.
9 748 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: I don't want
10 to beat this to death, but this does go to the heart of
11 an issue that we have heard here I think over the last
12 two days repeatedly. It seems to me that there is a
13 problem here, that if we are to encourage and to
14 cultivate local homegrown talent of a multicultural
15 nature, the type that our friend --
16 749 THE CHAIRPERSON: Bora Dragasevich.
17 750 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: Thank you.
18 That he was speaking about, the kind of access he has
19 been frustrated not to be able to obtain, how do we do
20 that if we bring in full-blown a foreign competitor?
21 How does these people get access?
22 751 MR. MARSHALL: I think I tried, but
23 obviously failed to communicate what I was saying.
24 First of all, this isn't just an ethnic problem. This
25 is a Canadian problem. The CRTC allows television
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1 networks in this country to use the majority of prime
2 time for American shows. Canadian actors, other
3 members of ACTRA who have been card carrying for a long
4 time find it difficult to get jobs because there aren't
5 enough jobs available.
6 752 I think in terms of -- is it going to
7 be that ethnic programming is going to produce a
8 million new stars in various ethnic groups across
9 Canada? It hasn't happened for Canadian French or
10 Canadian English talents. No likelihood it will happen
11 any faster for them, except it is quite possible, as I
12 said, Canadian television is not exported around the
13 world. Canadian programming is exported around the
14 world, but no one has expressed any interest in
15 Canadian channels around the world, with the exception
16 perhaps of MuchMusic selling the format.
17 753 But if somebody uses the money that
18 the foreign channel which is global and has 180 million
19 viewers around the world, or 280 million viewers around
20 the world, sees a show produced on a professional level
21 by somebody from that ethnic persuasion in Toronto and
22 they like that person, they are going to want it. Not
23 just for the half hour or hour that that show is on,
24 but possibly for them to be an international star, as I
25 gave you the example of the Canadian stars singing
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1 country music or singing ballads or whatever. They
2 only became magically stars around the rest of the
3 world when they had access.
4 754 Right now it is hard enough for a
5 Canadian ethnic broadcast talent to get exposure in
6 this country. There is no exposure for them
7 internationally. This is one way to do it.
8 755 MS RUDA: Commissioner Langford, I
9 would just like to address that question that you
10 asked. How do you account for the problem which was
11 mentioned yesterday with the grey and black market? We
12 have got a lot of grey and black market dishes here and
13 there are many different reasons that people have been
14 buying grey and black market dishes, but in the ethnic
15 communities it is because they wish to receive
16 foreign-language programming.
17 756 So, while I am not advocating that we
18 have to totally change everything that is going on in
19 Canada, there is obviously a market other than just
20 people who are in remote areas who need to receive some
21 type of television. There are people who -- again, I
22 agree with you -- who are ethnics and who want to
23 receive their own programming that is being made
24 available in the States, freely available, and they are
25 picking it up over the satellite. Can you perhaps
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1 answer that for me, how that should be dealt with?
2 757 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: We are here,
3 as my Chair just reminded me, to give you the last
4 word. So I am going to do that and we are going to
5 move on.
6 758 MS RUDA: No, you can't get out of
7 that. Answer that question.
8 759 THE CHAIRPERSON: Oh yes he can.
9 760 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: And we are
10 going to move on to the next person, but we will answer
11 that question. That's why we are here is to ultimately
12 answer those questions and we will struggle along, but
13 thank you for your assistance.
14 761 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
15 much. I am sorry to have to sort of curb Stuart's
16 desire to engage in a longer conversation with you, but
17 we have 32 more parties to hear from tonight.
18 762 We are quite willing to stay as long
19 as that takes, but I am not sure about the 32nd party
20 who is here at midnight. So, I am going to try and
21 move us along.
22 763 In spite of what I said earlier that
23 we would wrap up at six o'clock and break for half an
24 hour, we are going to hear from two more parties before
25 we break.
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1 764 Madam Secretary, please call the next
2 party.
3 765 MS RHÉAUME: The next presenter is
4 Bora Hincer, President of the Federation of Canadian
5 Turkish Associations. If you would like to introduce
6 your party. Bora Hincer.
7 766 We will move on to the next party and
8 come back to that one later perhaps.
9 767 Professor Spyros Flengas of the
10 Hellenic-Canadian Federation of Ontario.
11 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
12 768 DR. FLENGAS: Yes.
13 769 Ladies and gentlemen, Mr. Chairman,
14 good evening.
15 770 My name is Spyros Flengas and I am
16 the President of the Hellenic-Canadian Federation of
17 Ontario, the organization which represents the
18 communities and associations in ontario of about
19 150,000 members of the Greek community. Next to me is
20 the Secretary General of the Federation, Mr. George
21 Efstratiadis.
22 771 We welcome the opportunity to appear
23 before the CRTC and give our opinion on the issue of
24 ethnic broadcasting. it is our opinion that the
25 current policy of the CRTC to protect ethnic
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1 broadcasting and to allow cultural minorities to have
2 their own television and radio stations is a sound one
3 and much needed in our communities.
4 772 Today we are going to discuss out of
5 the many possible issues four issues, namely the
6 evaluation of the present system, then its ability to
7 serve the needs of our community. Third, the point of
8 access and, fourth, the costs of some of these
9 programs. I will start with the evaluation of the
10 present system.
11 773 Unfortunately, the mainstream media
12 neither have the economic interest nor the time to
13 cover the activities and interests of our communities
14 and associations. in our cast, it is almost
15 exclusively that the Greek media cover our events and
16 carry out messages to our people.
17 774 We consider it a blessing that the
18 new digital technology has allowed the CRTC the
19 opportunity to license third language ethnic television
20 program specialty channels.
21 775 We are grateful that now, through
22 Odyssey Television, as well as the other Greek TV
23 programs, the Greek Canadian community of Ontario and
24 Canada at large has its own channel in which the
25 interests of our youth and their aspirations may be
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1 realized and through which our people may be informed,
2 educated and entertained not only with programs from
3 Greece, but also from our communities in Canada.
4 776 Mr. George Efstratiadis can continue.
5 777 MR. EFSTRATIADIS: Thank you,
6 Professor Flengas.
7 778 I am going to draw your attention on
8 the first issue, which is the one of serving and
9 satisfying the needs of the community.
10 779 Our people have been greatly confused
11 regarding other GREEk TV signals which are freely
12 advertised in our community and are fed by satellite
13 from the United States of America. The question to ask
14 is: Are they legal or not? they naturally wonder. And
15 if they are not, why the government and the CRTC do not
16 stop them. It is a question which has not been
17 addressed adequately by our government, so that our
18 people can have a better picture. Perhaps some
19 relevant CRTC dissemination of information towards the
20 minority communities might be the solution.
21 780 The truth is, however, as we see it,
22 our people wish to see programs both from Greece and
23 from here. Our local TV programs are very important
24 for the advancement of our community, news and activity
25 projects and the programs from Greece are important
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1 mainly for our entertainment and news. Therefore, the
2 CRTC's present policy to force TV programmers to have
3 locally produced Canadian programs along with programs
4 from Greece is an important policy to be continued.
5 Having only programs from Greece does not help our
6 associations and communities to promote themselves.
7 The local programs, while promoting us, they also
8 promote Canadian citizenship and Canadian unity. Also,
9 local programs need the entertainment and news programs
10 from Greece. Thus, the present balance in the CRTC's
11 policy is a good one.
12 781 The second issue is a question of
13 access. I wish to draw to your attention the question
14 of access to the distribution of ethnic broadcasters.
15 We know that it has taken Odyssey more than two years
16 to find a distributor to carry their signal to our
17 people. This we find unacceptable that mainstream
18 media do find accommodation in all the distribution
19 systems, while ethnic channels, such as Odyssey, had
20 access just a month ago and only with some
21 distributors.
22 782 We believe that every Canadian,
23 regardless of geography and regardless if one resides
24 in a single or multiple dwelling, or even more
25 importantly regardless of ethnicity, must have equal
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1 access to the Canadian medium of their choice. It is
2 especially difficult for our people who reside in
3 multiple apartment units. Most of the management
4 companies do not allow them to receive Odyssey from
5 satellite dishes. And when they do, they find that
6 cable companies have exclusivity on TV distribution,
7 although they do not yet have digital boxes to give to
8 the people. This is an unfair benefit given to cable
9 companies which often force us to buy the packages they
10 alone design, but we must pay because we like only the
11 signal in that package.
12 783 The third issue is that of cost.
13 Most of our people are willing to pay Odyssey the
14 monthly fee of $14.95. However, the distributors force
15 you to pay in addition of the above amount,
16 approximately $22 per month for basic mainstream
17 channels and also $11 a month for the rental of their
18 digital decoder. Therefore, each Greek Canadian who
19 wishes to support its own channel must pay an average
20 of $48 a month, most of which benefits the distributor
21 and not our community channel.
22 784 We find it repulsive that the
23 consumer must finance a distributor's equipment in
24 addition for the cost of the product they deliver to
25 our homes. This is a huge disincentive for the support
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1 of third-language channels. Distributors benefit a lot
2 as it is now and they must not be allowed to benefit
3 even more from small community channels.
4 785 Ladies and gentlemen, the last
5 thought I wish to leave with you is the fact that most
6 of the ethnic communities in Canada are mature enough
7 and deserve to have their own media with the blessing
8 of our government and government agencies, such as the
9 CRTC.
10 786 We strongly believe that a cultural
11 community in Canada which is strong in preserving its
12 own culture -- and the media play a central in this
13 area -- it is also strong in preserving Canadian unity
14 and identity.
15 787 Thank you very much.
16 788 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
17 much, gentlemen.
18 789 MS RHÉAUME: The next presentation is
19 by Ms Yvonne Bogorya, President of the Polish-Canadian
20 Women's Federation.
21 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
22 790 MS BOGORYA: Thank you for allowing
23 me to speak before the break.
24 791 I am starting with a problem
25 statement and then the key issues and afterwards I will
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1 answer the three questions that you were posing in your
2 letter.
3 792 We feel that there is a strong need
4 for the CRTC to continue to encourage the growth of
5 ethnic broadcasting, which means that we feel that you
6 have already done a lot, but there is a need for more
7 because with the growing ethnic market there is a need
8 for increased ethnic programming.
9 793 We need to determine clearly the
10 definition of the term "Canadian content". We feel
11 that ethnic broadcasting should be part of it. We
12 don't want to be isolated. We feel that we would like
13 to communicate information and share our cultural
14 heritage with others.
15 794 We also need to preserve the language
16 and culture and we need to have access to the most
17 recent technology, interacting the world that is a
18 global village. more financial and technical resources
19 are needed to produce programs in languages other than
20 English and French.
21 795 What are the key issues? First of
22 all, the mainstream TV and radio programming very often
23 doesn't portray the ethnic groups, particularly when I
24 talk about Polish-Canadian women, hardly ever do I see
25 any portrayal of Polish women. The same refers to
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1 other, Spanish and other groups.
2 796 So, I think we need to think about --
3 the Canadian population being diverse, we need to be
4 reflected in the programs and on the screen.
5 797 In view of recent statistics, when
6 you look at the programs and the population size and
7 the time that each station has, sometimes this is
8 inadequate. I was looking at the Polish program, let's
9 say we are the fourth biggest group in Ontario and we
10 are allocated -- we have two TV station programs, a
11 CFMT program, "Variety" and City-TV, "Polish Studio"
12 and six radio programs. The total time is three hours
13 a week and 15.8 hours radio time. So, it's three hours
14 a week TV time and 15.8 radio time.
15 798 Whereas the Portuguese group, for
16 example, which is the third largest, has 13 hours of TV
17 time and 87 hours of radio time. So there are some
18 disproportions in terms of population served,
19 geographical range, geographical access because some
20 areas don't receive programs in time to allow for
21 adequate access to other Polish Canadian communities.
22 799 For example, I remember when we
23 supported the CFMT application to broadcast their
24 programming in Vancouver. We have a large
25 Polish-Canadian community in Vancouver and it was
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1 denied, unfortunately.
2 800 The third issue is funding of course.
3 Funding for research and Canadian-based productions, to
4 enhance presentation of ethnocultural groups, the
5 heritage and portrayal of ethnic women, immigrants and
6 members of the community.
7 801 For many members of the
8 Polish-Canadian community, especially those who
9 experience barriers in benefiting from the mainstream
10 programming, these programs are the only source of
11 information and the only contact with the community, so
12 they play a very important role. Thank you for their
13 existence. We don't want to have less. We want to
14 have more.
15 802 Community events and programs devoted
16 to cultural heritage and achievements of Polish
17 Canadians would not be possible to be received without
18 those channels. The multicultural TV is very important
19 in here and we feel that other channels could also
20 contain some programs that would talk about heritage of
21 Canadians in Canada who are part of multiculturalism.
22 803 I remember -- I have been talking
23 about multiculturalism for 20 or 25 years and as Elvira
24 said, we still want to see tangible results.
25 804 MS SANCHEZ DE MALICKI: We are still
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1 very dumb.
2 805 MS BOGORYA: We are here.
3 806 Ethnic communities often struggle
4 with insufficient financing to do research and to do
5 creative and challenging programs. We need up-to-date
6 technology, studio space, accessibility to camera and
7 cameramen time. Very often this becomes a limitation
8 because cameramen cannot leave a studio and the event
9 is somewhere else, or there are some problems with
10 logistics.
11 807 Script and production money, to
12 create really challenging programs, special effects,
13 lighting -- more ambitious projects could be realized
14 with professional and financial support. It is my
15 contention that the so-called Canadian content programs
16 could benefit from the talent and expertise available
17 in our ethnic communities. Speaking on behalf of my
18 organization, I would like to see more portrayal of
19 women.
20 808 THE CHAIRPERSON: Me too.
21 809 MS BOGORYA: Also, we would like to
22 see the contribution of Canadians to the world of arts,
23 business, politics, culture, more information about
24 international affairs. It doesn't have to be a foreign
25 program purchased. There could be programs containing
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1 more information about Europe, Asia and South America
2 and so on.
3 810 So we don't feel that the current
4 programs are not meeting our needs. They are meeting
5 our essential needs, but we look at enhancing and
6 enriching and growth into the millennium.
7 811 Given the democratic changes that
8 have taken place in Canada, how can the needs and
9 interests of ethnocultural communities be served?
10 812 Well, we feel that current
11 demographics indicate growing diversity of Canadian
12 population. As my predecessor said, it is not
13 reflected very often in the media.
14 813 We should think about being part of
15 the global village and we need to report community
16 events, not only mainstream events.
17 814 The changing needs of ethnocultural
18 audiences need to be researched. I think there should
19 be some survey of ethnic communities from the
20 perspective of their changing needs, interests and
21 concerns, especially the new immigrants coming in.
22 There might be some gap between the various age groups,
23 geographical areas, different interests.
24 815 Better use of available technology is
25 very important here and computer literacy. I must say
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1 that very often because of financial limitations we are
2 not so -- access is not adequate enough because we are
3 sort of disadvantaged in being able to use the
4 available and existing technology. So, we are talking
5 about cyperspace and using Internet and not everybody
6 has access to it. So, this is a key issue: How can we
7 participate fully in the information highway and
8 ethnocultural stations need access to the resources to
9 do that.
10 816 The third question: Should there be
11 a priority on the development of Canadian ethnocultural
12 services rather than importing foreign services? Yes,
13 I say there should be a priority for Canadian
14 production.
15 817 The development of Canadian
16 ethnocultural services programs that are important to
17 our community, it is very important. Although there
18 should be a balance in importing foreign services, I
19 agree with the current regulations which produce such a
20 balance. I think we have already a good mix of how
21 much we can have foreign content and how much Canadian,
22 but there should be some focus on documentary programs,
23 dramas, all kinds of productions which reflect ethnic
24 groups in Canada and would show their contribution to
25 Canadian culture.
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1 818 These programs could be exported. I
2 mean we could be visible on the international scene if
3 we export our own programs outside.
4 819 We also feel that there is more
5 knowledge and understanding of our contribution of each
6 ethnic group, so there should be some communication and
7 some sharing and exchanging, so we are not isolated in
8 separate ghettos. I think this theme of better
9 understanding dialogue and understanding of our
10 traditions and contributions to Canadian history,
11 political, social and cultural life is very important.
12 820 Also, we need to think about our next
13 generation of young Canadians who need to be proud of
14 their ancestry and be aware of their place in Canadian
15 history. For them it's a sense of preservation of
16 their identity. They need to know that they are
17 neither French nor English, that they belong to other
18 language groups and they should be as proud of their
19 origin.
20 821 I think by portraying the subject,
21 the themes, the historical programs or programs that
22 talk about their heritage will improve their sense of
23 self-identity. So, here the media will play an
24 educational role.
25 822 Sometimes programs could be broadcast
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1 in English or French, as long as they also talk about
2 ethnic groups. So, it's another area to look at in
3 terms of content.
4 823 International affairs -- I think we
5 do need a little bit more information about what is
6 happening in other countries, Europe, Asia and Africa,
7 South America. I think there would be an interest in
8 audiences to listen to those events. Just to give you
9 an example, the current events in Central Europe,
10 Poland is becoming part of NATO and, of course, this is
11 starting some interest. People want to know more about
12 what is happening within the European Union. So these
13 events are of interest to our audiences.
14 824 Of course, the ethnocultural stations
15 are well equipped because of the knowledge of the
16 language to transfer that information.
17 825 I will present a more detailed brief
18 later on. I am just trying to cover the main points.
19 826 Thank you.
20 827 THE CHAIRPERSON: Ms Bogorya, I want
21 to explore one area and that is actually an area that a
22 number of presenters have raised today. As you know,
23 the CRTC is involved in a process looking at the whole
24 issue of new media and a number of the people who came
25 before us to make presentations talked about the
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1 ability of the Internet to supply programming, I guess
2 at the point at which television and the Internet
3 converge. The ability of the Internet to supply
4 programming for ethnocultural groups who are not
5 currently being served by the traditional distribution
6 system.
7 828 I am wondering if that has anything
8 to do with the fact that you mentioned it or what
9 aspect of the Internet are you exploring in your work
10 on this issue?
11 829 MS BOGORYA: We may have some
12 generation gap here. Of course, younger persons are
13 more perhaps well versed in the Internet than the older
14 generation. But apart from that, as I said the
15 financial issue of accessibility to ethnocultural
16 groups would be a problem. I think you may lose some
17 contact that you already have through ethnocultural
18 stations.
19 830 I don't think the Internet would --
20 eventually in the future it is possible, but I don't
21 think we are there as of yet.
22 831 THE CHAIRPERSON: Generally, the TV
23 image is quite small, so it's pretty hard to sit in
24 front of your computer monitor and watch a program.
25 832 MS BOGORYA: It will happen.
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1 833 THE CHAIRPERSON: But I mean with
2 web-TV, the evolution of web-TV, it has been suggested
3 to us that that is one of the ways of sort of freeing
4 up the logjam of capacity issues in terms of delivering
5 more niche programming services to the ethnocultural
6 communities.
7 834 MS BOGORYA: What is more important
8 is this is another media, but what is more important is
9 that you do portray ethnocultural groups in these
10 programs, that you have more input, that we have more
11 voice. I think this is a more important issue than how
12 we are communicating -- I mean through what channel.
13 835 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much
14 for your contribution this afternoon.
15 836 We are going to take a break now. We
16 are running about a half an hour late. We will be
17 returning at 7 p.m. and will continue on with our list
18 of participants at that point.
19 837 Thank you.
20 --- Short recess at 1830 / Courte suspension à 1830
21 --- Upon resuming at 1900 / Reprise à 1900
22 838 THE CHAIRPERSON: Ladies and
23 gentlemen, I would ask you to take your seats.
24 839 I would like to remind any
25 participants who are going to be presenting tonight
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1 that we are endeavouring to keep to about 10 minutes
2 for the oral presentation, so that if we do want to ask
3 questions there is time without us having to stay here
4 until 1:00 in the morning. So, anything you can do to
5 be succinct would be very much appreciated.
6 840 Madam Secretary, please call the
7 first participant.
8 841 MS RHÉAUME: The next participant is
9 Mr. Michael Caine of CJMR Radio.
10 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
11 842 MR. CAINE: Thank you very much. I
12 am going to talk about something completely different.
13 Radio, and ethnic broadcasting radio.
14 843 I am the President of CJMR 1320 Radio
15 Limited, a full ethnic station licensed at Mississauga,
16 ontario. With me is harry McDonald, CJMR's
17 Vice-President of Sales and Marketing.
18 844 Throughout your public consultations
19 I am sure you will hear a lot about heritage. Well,
20 CJMR's heritage is that its parent company, CHWO Radio
21 Limited, was one of the first broadcast stations in
22 Canada, radio or TV, to recognize the need for ethnic
23 programming when, in 1957 it began broadcasting a
24 significant and regular schedule of third-language
25 services. In 1993, we consolidated the format of our
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1 two stations by transferring all of CHWO's ethnic
2 programming to CJMR, thus making it a full ethnic
3 station.
4 845 Because of our extensive experience
5 in ethnic broadcasting,both Mr. McDonald and I were
6 heavily involved in the consultation, development and
7 evolution of the CRTC policy reflecting Canada's
8 linguistic and cultural diversity that was released in
9 1985 -- although at the time, Mr. McDonald was
10 Vice-President of Channel 47, CFMT-TV.
11 846 We are pleased to say that this
12 policy was well conceived, thorough and visionary. It
13 has served the industry, Canada's multicultural
14 communities and the country as a whole extremely well.
15 In fact, it is our position that today, almost 15 years
16 after its introduction, this policy does not need to be
17 changed a great deal in order for it to remain relevant
18 and effective.
19 847 The call for comments to review this
20 policy was also thorough. We will be submitting a
21 complete, written submission in a month's time, but
22 today, because of time constraints, we will focus on
23 what we feel are some of the more important issues
24 raised in your call.
25 848 The first item we would like to
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1 address is the types of ethnic programming. We think
2 that the policy could be streamlined considerably and
3 made to be more effectively relevant if the
4 identification of types of ethnic programming were to
5 be eliminated all together or, at least, reduced
6 considerably.
7 849 We have come to accept that any
8 program that is directed at a specific and distinct
9 community whose cultural and/or linguistic heritage is
10 other than English, French or native Canadian is indeed
11 an ethnic program. it is really irrelevant what
12 language is spoken in the program.
13 850 In fact, with five different choices
14 of types of ethnic programming, things can fall between
15 the cracks. For example, under the current policy,
16 broadcasters can, and we and the Commission are aware
17 of instances where they have, air programs in English
18 that are directed at a specific ethnic community but
19 claim it as Type E programming, instead of B or,
20 perhaps, C. Since the Type E designation does not
21 restrict the conventional broadcaster to the 15 per
22 cent limit, he or she can go about soliciting listeners
23 and advertising from that targeted ethnic community
24 unchecked and unfettered, to the potential detriment of
25 an existing ethnic broadcaster.
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1 851 A clear, simple and streamlined
2 definition of what is ethnic programming ought to be
3 established. In other words, its a program principally
4 directed at a distinct ethnocultural group or it is
5 not.
6 852 The next area that we would like to
7 address is the availability, accessability and
8 diversity of ethnic service.
9 853 We feel that the current policy
10 balances pretty well the academic desire to encourage
11 programming services to as many different and distinct
12 cultural groups as possible with the reality of
13 restrictions due to the availability of time and the
14 financial and market conditions required to support
15 individual ethnic programs.
16 854 In the Greater Toronto Area, the
17 nation's most culturally diverse centre, there are six
18 ethnic radio stations, one ethnic television station,
19 three ethnic specialty TV services, two non-ethnic
20 television stations carrying ethnic programming, eight
21 ethnic SCMO services, two closed circuit ethnic radio
22 services on cable, two campus radio stations carrying
23 ethnic programming and at least five ethnic services on
24 the list of Part II eligible satellite services.
25 855 Our guess would be that there are
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1 very few ethnic communities within the GTA that are not
2 being served by the ethnic broadcast media at the
3 present time.
4 856 And, by and large, we suspect that
5 the amount and variety of ethnic broadcast services in
6 other centre across Canada is proportionate,
7 appropriate and commensurate to each community's
8 linguistic and cultural diversity. Such is the natural
9 balance of things in a free and market-driven system.
10 857 At the same time, through the public
11 application process that looks at the issues on a
12 case-by-case basis and the Commission's regulatory
13 control by way of conditions of licence, the playing
14 field is kept relatively level, protecting the
15 viability of existing ethnic licensees.
16 858 Thus, we feel that the ways and means
17 of providing ethnic broadcast services as governed by
18 the existing policy need not be changed and the
19 existing distinctions still work well, that is:
20 859 One, mainstream stations can
21 broadcast up to 15 per cent ethnic programming without
22 CRTC approval;
23 860 Two, stations wishing to do between
24 15 per cent and 40 per cent ethnic must publicly apply
25 to the Commission to do so and a favourable decision
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1 might include specific conditions of licence;
2 861 And, three, stations wishing to
3 achieve full ethnic status, i.e. not less than 60 per
4 cent ethnic programming, must also publicly apply to
5 the Commission and, again, a favourable decision would
6 be subject to specific conditions of licence.
7 862 In this regard, we concur that the
8 lack of available radio frequencies at least, precludes
9 the establishment of a single ethnic language service.
10 We think, therefore, that the Commission ought to
11 continue to impose a condition of licence that a
12 minimum number of distinct and different ethnocultural
13 communities be served with that number determined on a
14 case-by-case basis. Otherwise, the practice that has
15 come to be known as "cream skimming" of the larger,
16 more lucrative ethnic markets becomes a detrimental
17 factor.
18 863 We do not agree, however, with the
19 suggestion that larger ethnocultural groups be used to
20 subsidize the delivery of less profitable programming
21 to smaller groups. To include such an imposition in an
22 ethnic broadcasting policy is unrealistic and
23 unreasonable.
24 864 As the Commission is aware, CJMR
25 operates primarily on the brokerage system. Prior to
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1 1985, we fought long and hard against the stigmas that
2 had been erroneously associated with brokerage and we
3 are pleased that the current policy not only recognizes
4 this method of providing ethnic broadcasting services
5 as bona fide, but actually credits it with stimulating
6 the development of the Canadian production of ethnic
7 programs which might not otherwise have been produced.
8 865 Commercially licensed broadcast
9 stations are businesses. Whether you are a
10 conventional station or an ethnic licensee, if that
11 segment of the audience that you wish to reach, be it
12 in a single program or in your overall format, does not
13 support your efforts in either listenership or, more
14 importantly, revenue, then you have failed in a
15 fundamental requirement of staying in business -- make
16 a profit. I suggest that if it is deemed to be
17 worthwhile, let the government subsidize unprofitable
18 programming to smaller groups through grants or by
19 requiring cable's community channel to carry such
20 programming on a non-commercial basis, which is what I
21 thought they were supposed to be doing in the first
22 place.
23 866 Someone once described our ethnic
24 markets as moving targets. It's true: Changing
25 immigration patterns, linguistic and cultural
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1 assimilation, shifts in socio-economic trends,
2 political initiatives -- these and more require today's
3 ethnic broadcaster to be even more flexible than ever
4 before and offer a schedule of programming that not
5 only responds to the demands of the ethnic
6 market-place, but is also profitable.
7 867 At CJMR, we are pleased to be able to
8 offer available time to any independent ethnic program
9 producer who comes forward with a desire to inform and
10 entertain a particular ethnic community within our
11 coverage area. Just as potential commercial licensees,
12 however, are asked to convince the Commission that
13 their proposal is financially viable, all we ask is
14 that the program become self-sustaining.
15 868 Finally, a word or two about Canadian
16 content. In the Commission's call for comments, it is
17 correctly stated that ethnic radio stations face a
18 considerable challenge in obtaining recordings that
19 qualify as Canadian suitable for ethnic programs and
20 that limited resources curtail an individual ethnic
21 licensee from being able to deliver Canadian talent
22 that reflects all of the significant ethnocultural
23 groups in its service area.
24 869 Unfortunately, we are unable at this
25 time to give you any quantifiable data that could help
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1 in determining whether or not an increase from 7 per
2 cent Cancon to , say 10 per cent or 12 per cent is
3 warranted or achievable. Our considerable experience
4 gives us a gut feeling that an increase at this time
5 would, in fact, prove to be very difficult.
6 870 A big part of the problem is, of
7 course, not knowing what material is available. That
8 is why we are very interested in exploring the proposal
9 that a pooling of resources, coupled with external
10 support -- financial and otherwise -- could be a very
11 positive step forward in increasing by a meaningful
12 degree the supply of Canadian ethnic music. The
13 development of a national Canadian ethnic music
14 database, as suggested in the call for comments, would
15 be an extremely useful tool for ethnic programmers to
16 use in satisfying any Cancon requirement.
17 871 Here's one possible suggestion:
18 Change the qualifying criteria for ethnic Canadian
19 content from two out of four in the MAPL system to only
20 one out of four. A lot of Canadian ethnic performers,
21 for example, record songs in other countries that were
22 not written or composed by a Canadian. Hence, the
23 recording doesn't qualify as Cancon. Some relaxation
24 of the criteria might help ethnic stations to increase
25 their Cancon quotas. We might even be able to play
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1 Celine Dion for once and count her as Canadian.
2 872 We feel, then, that it would be
3 premature to increase the Canadian content level for
4 ethnic stations at this time. Instead, a comprehensive
5 investigation should be done to determine just how much
6 Canadian ethnic material is currently available;
7 develop an evolving database that all ethnic
8 programmers could use; and then determine what increase
9 in Cancon can be accomplished and how it ought to be
10 phased in.
11 873 Ladies and gentlemen, I think I have
12 run out of time, so that concludes our remarks.
13 874 Thank you for allowing us to
14 participate in this public consultation and we would be
15 happy to answer any questions you may have.
16 875 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you for
17 sharing your information and point of view with us, Mr.
18 Caine. Commissioner Langford has a question for you.
19 876 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: Just one
20 question because I have been dying to hear a little
21 more about radio. We have heard a lot about
22 television. It has been very interesting.
23 877 One or two of the presenters this
24 evening spoke about a role for the CBC in television
25 and changing its role and perhaps making different
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1 roles nationally and locally. Do you have any thoughts
2 on what the CBC's role should be, either nationally or
3 locally, in radio from an ethnic or third-language
4 perspective?
5 878 MR. CAINE: Far be it for me to
6 program our national broadcaster, but let me try.
7 879 THE CHAIRPERSON: Everyone likes to
8 try.
9 880 MR. CAINE: I do believe that the CBC
10 has a role that it has not accepted completely yet to
11 reflect Canada's cultural mosaic in terms of its
12 programming in not only third languages, but in English
13 to communities that are not English, French or native
14 Canadian.
15 881 I am not sure that they have indeed
16 reflected totally our nation. You spoke earlier, you
17 were talking about television, Commissioner, in answer
18 to another question, about how does the CBC television
19 make its programming decisions when it has got
20 something in Yellowknife and it has this large and
21 diverse country to program to.
22 882 But Yellowknife compared to the
23 ethnic communities of Canada is a spit in the ocean.
24 If the CBC feels that it must give prominence to its
25 viewers or listeners in Yellowknife, nothing against
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1 Yellowknife of course, at the exclusion, however, of
2 our ethnic communities, I don't think that's a real
3 true picture of Canada. With 50 per cent of our
4 population not English, French or native, then I think
5 they are missing the boat by not reflecting that
6 diverse community of our country.
7 883 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: Thanks very
8 much.
9 884 MS RHÉAUME: Our next speaker is Ms
10 Rose Sottile of the Italian Canadians, Toronto
11 District.
12 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
13 885 MS SOTTILE: Good evening. My name
14 is Rose Sottile and I am a member of the National
15 Congress of Italian Canadians, Toronto District's Board
16 of Directors, and it gives me great pleasure to share
17 our views on the future of the CRTC's ethnic
18 programming policy.
19 886 Emilio Bisceglia, the Congress'
20 President who prepared the brief, sends his regrets for
21 not being able to attend these hearings himself.
22 887 Founded in 1960, the National
23 Congress of Italian Canadians, Toronto District, is an
24 umbrella organization that represents approximately
25 one-half million Canadians of Italian heritage who
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1 reside in the Greater Metropolitan Toronto area. For
2 four decades the National Congress of Italian
3 Canadians, Toronto District, has successfully lobbied
4 to preserve and promote the goals and aspirations of
5 Canadians of Italian heritage in the areas of social,
6 cultural, education and political interests. This
7 submission is part and parcel of the work that we
8 undertake.
9 888 We advance that underlying the CRTC's
10 ethnic broadcasting policy is a belief that ethnic
11 radio and television undertakings should inform,
12 educate and entertain Canadians. If we believe that
13 cultural and linguistic diversity are integral parts of
14 Canada and fundamental characteristics of our society,
15 then we must ensure that diversity is recognized and
16 celebrated on our airwaves.
17 889 This policy renewal discussion will
18 help ensure that the broadcasting environment can
19 continue to meet these needs in today's changing world
20 and we congratulate the Commission for undertaking this
21 initiative.
22 890 Among the issues that these hearings
23 will probe is the extent to which the present
24 broadcasting system serves Canada's ethnocultural
25 communities. While we recognize that the current
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1 policy environment and the commitment of broadcasters
2 have allowed a resilient ethnocultural broadcasting
3 system to evolve, we believe that there is room for
4 significant improvement and efforts must be made to
5 ensure that the current system is not allowed to
6 deteriorate.
7 891 Today, in the Greater Metropolitan
8 Toronto Area, there are six radio stations, two closed
9 circuit audio services, one ethnic television station
10 and three ethnic specialty channels which broadcast
11 ethnocultural programming. Canadians of Italian
12 heritage have access to two television stations, CFMT
13 and Telelatino, which broadcast some programming in
14 their native language.
15 892 In spite of the successes in the past
16 years, we have witnessed a deterioration of the system.
17 The amount of hours of daily programming in the Italian
18 language have decreased on CFMT. This has occurred
19 under the purported pretext of increasing daily
20 broadcasting in other ethnic languages.
21 893 However, at the same time, we have
22 noticed that CFMT is aggressively promoting an
23 extensive English-language schedule. English-language
24 programming no doubt results in a substantial profit
25 for CFMT. However, it does not appear that these
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1 monies are being reinvested in the development and
2 enhancement of Italian-language programming.
3 894 While the station's ability to make a
4 profit must be preserved, there must also be some sort
5 of refinement to the current policy of ethnic
6 programming to ensure that local programming is in fact
7 developed. We cannot allow our multicultural stations
8 to become the whole distributors of English-language
9 programming, while the question of reinvestment is
10 ignored.
11 895 In the spirit of its licence and in
12 the interest of ethnocultural communities, we must
13 develop more ethnic-language programming, not less, to
14 showcase and promote issues that are relevant to ethnic
15 communities that these stations are mandated to serve.
16 896 Further refinement and reinforcement
17 of the current policy must occur in order to ensure
18 that the profits generated from these ethnic television
19 stations can be reinvested for the betterment of
20 programming needs and the development of more homegrown
21 programs.
22 897 The second item that we were asked to
23 consider dealt with demographic shifts in Canada's
24 population. A large portion of today's
25 Canadian-Italian community whose primary language is
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1 Italian are now retiring. At this time, more than
2 ever, we believe that an increased effort must be made
3 by broadcasters to reach these Canadians of Italian
4 heritage.
5 898 Another submission to these hearings
6 advances that perhaps in the Greater Metropolitan
7 Toronto area advertising dollars could be used to
8 support the establishment of a cable community
9 television channel to specifically serve Canadians of
10 Italian heritage. This is a suggestion which must be
11 given serious consideration, given the reduction in
12 broadcast hours in Italian at CFMT and the significant
13 population that speaks Italian as a first language in
14 the Greater Metropolitan Toronto area.
15 899 Over the past year a transformation
16 has occurred at Telelatino with respect to its range of
17 programming. In part, it has changed its focus to
18 target younger Italian Canadians. It is our view that
19 these programming changes have had a detrimental impact
20 in terms of the quality and, in fact, the quantity of
21 programming available to Telelatino viewers. This has
22 been compounded by the reduction of Italian language
23 broadcast hours at CFMT, which has resulted in more and
24 more Canadians of Italian heritage looking to
25 Telelatino to be their primary source of
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1 Italian-language programming.
2 900 There is, however, a practical
3 limitation in this change. As we understand it,
4 Telelatino's current licence restricts it from
5 providing any news programs. This licence condition
6 for Telelatino works to the detriment of the community.
7 CFMT is left without any competition with respect to
8 providing news service in the Italian language. We
9 fully believe in a free market economy and in
10 competition and that the removal of this restriction
11 will result in better broadcasting in the marketplace.
12 Given the large numbers of Canadians of Italian
13 heritage in this area, we believe that this licence
14 condition for Telelatino should be removed if it is
15 requested.
16 901 In order to address the needs and
17 interests of the Italian-Canadian community, we believe
18 that there should be a policy enacted to ensure that
19 there is a greater number of Italian language broadcast
20 hours on a daily basis and that such broadcast hours
21 should be developed locally.
22 902 The third item for consideration was
23 whether there should be a priority on the development
24 of Canadian ethnic services rather than the importation
25 of foreign programming. There have been some
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1 submissions that suggest in a free market economy the
2 CRTC's policies should be liberalized in order to allow
3 major Italian networks to broadcast into Canada.
4 Respectfully, we disagree with this assertion.
5 903 Further, we believe that the current
6 Canadian content conditions for the multicultural
7 television stations are also counterproductive. It is
8 our understanding that as a general requirement ethnic
9 broadcasters' licences require less Canadian content
10 programming than conventional broadcasters. We
11 understand that it is 40 per cent compared to 50 per
12 cent between 6 p.m. and midnight.
13 904 We submit that this requirement has
14 had the adverse effect of less programming in the
15 Italian language during prime-time hours. We believe
16 that where the market is able to sustain it, and we
17 believe that in the Greater Metropolitan Toronto area
18 such an initiative can be sustained, that CFMT and
19 other similar stations should be forced to meet the
20 Canadian content requirement required by mainstream
21 commercial broadcasters.
22 905 We believe that this change alone can
23 result in further community and ethnic language based
24 programming which in turn would help achieve the goals,
25 aims and aspirations of the ethnic broadcasting policy.
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1 906 On the question of transmission of
2 foreign services, while valuable, the retransmission of
3 foreign services from ethnic homelands does not serve
4 the needs and goals of the ethnic broadcasting policy.
5 907 For example, while foreign services
6 will no doubt deal with foreign policy, racial and
7 other dealings and provide a connection to one's
8 homeland, they will not serve the needs, interests,
9 aspirations and circumstances that Canadians of Italian
10 heritage specifically face in Toronto.
11 908 The only way to ensure this, of
12 course, is to force the broadcasters to promote and
13 develop Canadian product and enforce higher Canadian
14 content requirements. Indirectly, this change can
15 ensure that profits are rerouted back into Canada and
16 Canadian broadcasting operations and the development
17 and promotion of local Canadian news, information and
18 talent.
19 909 We believe that the Italian community
20 in Toronto has been forced to have a greater dependency
21 on foreign services because the local broadcasters have
22 failed to develop adequate local programs and there is
23 no policy impetus for them to pursue such endeavours.
24 910 In summary and in a different vein,
25 we believe that as we become more and more involved in
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1 a global society there are needs and opportunities that
2 will be missed by only an ethnic approach to
3 broadcasting. We are of the opinion that there is a
4 distinction that has been made between ethnic and
5 multicultural programming, a distinction which we
6 support. Notwithstanding our support for the ethnic
7 broadcasting policy which has been outlined throughout
8 the submission, there is a need for a multicultural
9 service that ensures Canadians of all heritage have
10 access to the views, positions, situations, culture and
11 entertainment of the peoples of the world. Canada must
12 take advantage of its multicultural heritage by
13 enabling all Canadians to have views of the world that
14 are broader and more direct than that provided by a few
15 international services available to them at this time.
16 911 Ethnic and multicultural broadcasting
17 are not one and the same thing, although each can be
18 supportive of the other. Multicultural broadcasting,
19 and in particular television, can be the catalyst that
20 opens up opportunities around the globe, provides
21 bridges of understanding between the diversity of the
22 peoples of the world and which can overcome narrowness
23 of understanding and perspective among Canadians and
24 their perspectives on the world.
25 912 Language need no longer be a barrier
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1 as quality subtitling is now available which opens the
2 cultures of the world to all. Ethnic broadcasting is
3 specific and exclusive, while multiculturalism is
4 inclusive and both should be incorporated in the
5 Canadian broadcasting system.
6 913 Thank you.
7 914 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
8 much.
9 915 MS RHÉAUME: The next presentation is
10 by Mr. David Palmer of the Cultural News Agency.
11 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
12 916 MR. PALMER: (Interpretation) I
13 thank you very much. I shall speak in Spanish and be
14 translated.
15 917 The Spanish-speaking community of
16 Toronto welcomes these public consultations and wishes
17 to address the federal government represented at the
18 CRTC about the duties and rights that bind and impel us
19 to participate in the consideration of what is ours,
20 the Hertzian waves of this country, to which we
21 contribute with our efforts, taxes and suffering, as
22 well as with the best of our qualities, dreams and
23 capabilities.
24 918 The very scarce multiethnic means of
25 communication have become a fortress of personal
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1 preferences and politics and have ruined the art of
2 communications conceived as information, entertainment
3 and culture.
4 919 Acknowledging the importance of all
5 the spaces we already have, we have also to recognize
6 the poorness of content due to the lack of democracy in
7 the policies that define minority participation.
8 920 It gets to the extreme abberation of
9 denying the right of minority programs to look for
10 sponsorships in the so-called national market, meaning
11 by this that large corporations and/or government
12 agencies who decide to grant a contract to the
13 multi-ethnic media in accordance to strategic
14 importance to the Canadian equation of housing
15 composition.
16 921 At the other end of these interests,
17 there is an eager mass searching for their own
18 identity. I do not want to be turned into a group of
19 loud followers of salsa, meringue or cauyunte
20 yadoes (ph) soap operas, even though of course there
21 should be room for all of this in this marvellous
22 concert of diversity that we have learned to love so
23 much of Canadian culture.
24 922 Unfortunately, cultural themes are
25 launched with total disrespect for their existence to
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1 small corners, very difficult to find, thus diluting
2 the possibility of generating a larger audience craving
3 for the knowledge.
4 923 We are told we are a mouse market, by
5 this meaning ridiculously small and are denied
6 primetime broadcasting where we could possibly
7 demonstrate the large potential of consumption of
8 Hispanics and Portuguese and other similar ethnic
9 groups -- groups that relate not only from a linguistic
10 point of view, but who share the enjoyment and taste
11 for other constructive and real of our own diversified
12 cultures made up of more than 20 nationalities, with
13 different mores, different climates, different
14 countries with enormous physical and cultural riches to
15 contribute.
16 924 We are talking about the bonds of
17 similarity and commitment that bind together from
18 Mexico to the very southern part of our continent
19 several millions more of human beings who share similar
20 cultures, very closely akin and related to Europeans
21 and parts of Asia.
22 925 Making the means of communication
23 more democratic, even if we keep its archaic structure
24 as far as possession through private concessions or
25 commercially organized people goes, there is still the
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1 outcry to benefit before anything else the minority
2 events. All the First Nations of Canada, of course,
3 are included, or at least to guarantee their own spaces
4 to identify and set their own courses in a united
5 manner, contribution to potential licks (ph) of Canada
6 to history and to the fate of a very important part of
7 this planet from a preferential side or place, which is
8 for us this political and economical stability of the
9 land we inhabit.
10 926 It is worth mentioning the amount of
11 abuse, discrimination and manipulation that is
12 characteristic of many pretence participation in all
13 means of communications. It is worth mentioning that
14 except in very few cases, even at certain stations
15 where same and some time has been assigned to the
16 Spanish language, all Hispanic minorities are treated
17 as third class and are not granted any potential growth
18 in their relationships of respect and preference given
19 to a client.
20 927 It is worth mentioning -- our
21 businesses, at the same time, suffer the impact of the
22 lack of specialized fixed and permanent means available
23 band and times during which our realities and roots
24 could be discussed, as well as where a lively debate
25 could occur on the commitment we all have to pull for
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1 our inclusion into this Canadian society.
2 928 The compulsory bureaucratic lobby and
3 the paradoxical lack of resources have displaced our
4 minority to be a guest without voice, or with voices
5 that are silent or censured in a very discrete manner
6 in the same of our rhythm that becomes heartbreakingly
7 commercial and to such a degree that our roots are kept
8 away from a relishing market that only buys when the
9 quality of the information or certain parameters of
10 opinion are met.
11 929 Today we have to demand the
12 opportunity to exercise a free press with a special
13 accent, with the resources of a free market of
14 communications and above all allowing the extensive and
15 active participation of all nationalities.
16 930 A community without a strong presence
17 in the means of communications, without the right to
18 discriminate their past as well as their present and
19 future is an ethnic group without hope and
20 opportunities. It is a community that has been
21 distanced and cut off of all possibilities with no
22 alternative or economic, political and cultural
23 development.
24 931 From ancient times, all messages and
25 communication networks have played a crucial role in
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1 the life of all nations. The marginalization of any
2 ethnic group residing in Canada, whether overt or
3 hidden, will go against the guiding principles of
4 multiculturalism living together.
5 932 The promotion and support of cultural
6 diversity with private enterprise assistance is one
7 element that should not be ignored, if properly
8 co-ordinated, as an answer to the needs of every
9 community.
10 933 It is only natural that the support
11 of government at all levels should be another assurance
12 to guarantee democratic links free from undue pressures
13 and giving us the pleasure and enjoyment of not feeling
14 under attack.
15 934 After several months of work with
16 different sectors of our Latin community in Toronto, I
17 would like to address some of the questions people
18 often ask themselves regarding the role of
19 communications in their development of minorities.
20 935 First, why is it that taxes to
21 licensing is not more democratic in order to give
22 access to communities who express their opinions, and
23 not only given to businessmen to whom these licences
24 are only a means to carry on a lucrative business and
25 who live far away and removed from the reality and
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1 suffering of those minorities which are the raison
2 d'etre of the licences?
3 936 Two, is it the serves or a monopoly?
4 What is the true meaning of a licence? Why are these
5 means far away removed from the reach of average
6 people? Why does a community feel threatened instead
7 of served? Why do they have to shut up and not be free
8 to express themselves freely in a free country?
9 937 Three, which are the procedures
10 followed by the CRTC to control and verify that
11 licences are really given for the service of minorities
12 and truly comply with all requirements demanded by the
13 Commission?
14 938 Fourth, why do companies who enjoy
15 the benefit of the frequencies do not have executives
16 and stockholders of the same nationality of the
17 communities they are supposed to represent?
18 939 Five, the Spanish-speaking community
19 in Canada is the ethnic group which is growing more
20 rapidly in this country. Statistics show that with the
21 signing of NAFTA between Canada, Mexico and the U.S.
22 and which is supposed to cover the whole continent in
23 the next 10 years, the role that Spanish plays in this
24 continent will become more prominent and so will be the
25 compelling need to share geographic spaces and new
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1 challenges for the integration to this next millennium.
2 940 THE CHAIRPERSON: Mr. Gonzales, (sic)
3 I am really sorry to interrupt you, but you have been
4 going for 20 minutes now with the interpretation and I
5 am just wondering if you could try and wrap up your
6 comments. You can always file anything else you have
7 to say in writing. It's just we have a big long list
8 of people to go through.
9 941 MR PALMER: (Interpretation) Yes,
10 that's fine. Thank you very much.
11 942 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very much
12 for your contribution.
13 943 MS RHÉAUME: The next speaker is mr.
14 Aldo di Felice, President of TLN Television.
15 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
16 944 MR. DI FELICE: Good evening. My
17 name is Aldo di Felice and I am President of Telelatino
18 Network Inc.
19 945 As Canada's national Italian and
20 Hispanic specialty television network since 1984, the
21 TLN Television Network provides 24 hours per day, seven
22 days per week of news, information, sports, drama,
23 children's shows and general entertainment programming
24 to Italian and Spanish-speaking audiences.
25 946 Telelatino is proud to have been a
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1 participant in the growth and development of Canadian
2 ethnic programming and we are also pleased to
3 participate in these public consultations. We are
4 proud to see sitting around this table this evening two
5 independent producers who produce programs enjoyed by
6 our Spanish-speaking audiences. I am also very pleased
7 to have sitting beside me Ms Claudia Caranci who
8 yesterday celebrated not only the launch of her
9 national Hispanic morning show, Buenas Dias Canada, but
10 also the eleventh anniversary of her joining TLN. I
11 think Claudia would want me to add that she started
12 working at a very young age.
13 947 THE CHAIRPERSON: Didn't we all.
14 948 MR. DI FELICE: Today, given the
15 amount of time available, I will focus my comments
16 primarily on the issue of the role of foreign services,
17 an issue which we consider to be critical to the
18 Commission's review of Canada's ethnic broadcasting
19 policy.
20 949 It is our respectful submission that
21 the treatment of this issue by the Commission will
22 profoundly impact Canada's ethnic broadcasters,
23 particularly ethnic specialty channels like ours.
24 950 Time permitting, I will also address
25 what we consider to be a related issue, that being the
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1 need to encourage and facilitate the production of
2 Canadian content programs by and for ethnic
3 broadcasters.
4 951 Regarding the role of foreign
5 services, Telelatino's ability to successfully continue
6 serving the needs and interests of its audiences
7 depends on the Commission's future approach to
8 non-Canadian ethnic services which may seek admission
9 into Canada.
10 952 The Commission's Public notice in
11 this matter refers to the technological changes that
12 have provided and will provide increased channel
13 capacity through digitization. Expanded capacity makes
14 possible the entry of more foreign third language
15 services via DTH, digital cable or otherwise.
16 953 But the CRTC has had a policy of not
17 authorizing the carriage in Canada or foreign services
18 that are competitive with a Canadian licensed pay or
19 specialty service. This policy must be maintained.
20 954 In Telelatino's case, the possible
21 entry into Canada of foreign Spanish or Italian
22 language services would have immediate and devastating
23 effects. First, already small audiences would be
24 split. Canadian ethnic services already serve
25 relatively small niche audiences and in some cases
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1 ethnic specialties already compete with over the air
2 multicultural broadcasters and mainstream broadcasters
3 doing ethnic programming too.
4 955 The niche ethnic audiences that are
5 already served by multiple Canadian broadcasters on
6 local, regional and national levels would be further
7 split by the introduction of non-Canadian ethnic
8 services.
9 956 If splitting niche audiences merely
10 meant that more public choice was available from a
11 wider selection of services, that would be fine. But
12 in the case of Canadian ethnic specialty channels like
13 Telelatino, audience splitting caused by the entry of
14 competitive foreign services would threaten the very
15 viability of the Canadian service.
16 957 This is especially true for a dual
17 ethnic broadcaster like us Telelatino increasingly
18 relies on the pooled advertising revenues of two
19 Canadian distinct ethnocultural groups in order to
20 support the operations of one, a single programming
21 service.
22 958 Audience fragmentation caused by the
23 entry of foreign services would seriously harm us in
24 two ways.
25 959 First, advertising rates must reduce
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1 with any actual or perceived dilution of our audiences.
2 960 Secondly, foreign services carry
3 multinational advertising and as a result, cannibalize
4 local Canadian advertising of products and services
5 already advertised internationally on the foreign
6 signal.
7 961 Thus, foreign services deprive
8 Canadian ethnic services of both viewership and
9 advertising revenues, thereby reducing the Canadian
10 service's ability to sustain themselves and contribute
11 to Canadian programming.
12 962 And all without any obligation on the
13 foreign services to make the kinds of contributions to
14 Canadian broadcasting that Canadian ethnic services do.
15 963 Non-Canadian services by their nature
16 do not address the particular wants and needs of a
17 Canadian ethnic audience and do not contribute to the
18 Canadian broadcasting system in the same ways. Allow
19 me to briefly count these ways.
20 964 First, foreign services do not
21 produce and broadcast Canadian programs.
22 965 Second, foreign services do not
23 select programs and do not schedule them with a view to
24 Canadian audiences.
25 966 Third, foreign services ignore local
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1 Canadian clubs, activities, institutions, leaders,
2 personalities, news and events.
3 967 Fourth, foreign services do nothing
4 to acclimatize and introduce recent Canadian immigrants
5 to the norms, practices, services, opportunities, laws
6 and social climate of Canada.
7 968 Fifth, foreign services lack the
8 local Canadian advertising content of Canadian ethnic
9 services. Ethnic audiences rely on such commercials as
10 an information resource. Canadian commercials aren't
11 just advertising tools; they often serve as a community
12 guide to the availability of goods and services.
13 969 And sixth, foreign services have no
14 local community involvement and no commitments. They
15 do not organize, sponsor or promote community festivals
16 or events. They don't even broadcast public service
17 announcements of the local Canadian ethnic communities.
18 970 These facts remain, whether or not
19 technological advances increase channel capacity.
20 Increased channel capacity makes carriage of foreign
21 services physically possible, but it should not make it
22 automatic. On the contrary, the free entry of
23 competing foreign services would erode and destroy the
24 foundations built by Canadian ethnic broadcasters like
25 Telelatino.
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1 971 It is our respectful submission that
2 in Canada, the admission of competing foreign ethnic
3 services, although seemingly adding more choice, does
4 not add overall value to the Canadian ethnic
5 broadcasting system. In fact, it will destabilize the
6 viability of existing Canadian ethnic broadcasters,
7 particularly specialty channels like ours.
8 972 It is our respectful submission that
9 the prospect of increased channel capacity is an
10 opportunity that must be used to benefit the Canadian
11 broadcasting system, not to harm it.
12 973 There is a way to do this. We
13 respectfully submit that the Commission must
14 unequivocally reaffirm its policy against allowing
15 competing foreign services to enter and undermine
16 existing Canadian specialty services.
17 974 once this policy is so reaffirmed,
18 existing and future Canadian services will be able to
19 realize the opportunities that new technologies have
20 presented and bring an even greater variety of ethnic
21 programming choices to Canadians in many different
22 ways, be it program acquisitions, partnerships, joint
23 ventures or future Canadian licensed services. The
24 result will be that the opportunity presented by
25 increased channel capacity enures to the benefit of
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1 Canadian broadcasters and the Canadian broadcasting
2 system. Rather than benefiting foreign services at the
3 expense of Canadian services.
4 975 To repeat, the Commission must not
5 allow competing foreign ethnic services to undermine
6 the very important role served by Canadian ethnic
7 services in the Canadian broadcasting system.
8 976 With your indulgence, I would also
9 like to comment on the related topic of Canadian
10 content programming by ethnic broadcasters.
11 977 I have mentioned Canadian content
12 programs as one of the obvious benefits of Canadian
13 ethnic services over non-Canadian ethnic services.
14 Offering unique Canadian perspectives and opportunities
15 for community involvement and interaction are obvious
16 advantages that Telelatino provides its viewers.
17 978 Canadian content production must be
18 supported and nurtured in ethnic broadcasting in the
19 same way it is in mainstream Canadian broadcasting.
20 979 But there are several disadvantages
21 and barriers faced by ethnic programming services in
22 accessing the numerous federal, provincial and private
23 television production funding programs. There are
24 three main obstacles.
25 980 First, the types of programs produced
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1 do not qualify for funding; second, non-English,
2 non-French, non-aboriginal language programs also do
3 not generally qualify and; third, broadcaster produced
4 in-house programs generally do not qualify under most
5 programs.
6 981 Dealing with the first of these
7 barriers, the genres of programs typically produced by
8 or for ethnic broadcasters, namely talk shows, public
9 affairs shows, instructional programs, tributes,
10 interstitials, magazine shows and news, do not qualify
11 for funding under most production industry support
12 programs.
13 982 Dramas and documentaries do qualify,
14 but Canadian ethnic broadcasters generally do not have
15 the financial capacity to undertake the development and
16 the production of these usually higher budget forms of
17 programming. Doing so would mean concentrating
18 production dollars and producing fewer but hopefully
19 better hours of programming.
20 983 The problem lies in the fact that
21 ethnic broadcasters generally produce rather than
22 purchase Cancon off the shelf because little or no
23 relevant Cancon exists to be bought. As a result,
24 concentrating program dollars into documentaries and
25 drama would leave ethnic broadcasters without enough
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1 Canadian programs to fulfil their Cancon broadcast
2 commitments.
3 984 Even where the genre of program
4 qualifies however, third language shows are generally
5 ineligible for funding.
6 985 As a result of these barriers, ethnic
7 broadcasters are usually paying 100 cents on the
8 dollar -- 100 cents on the production dollar required
9 to produce a program, as opposed to the 10 to 20 cents
10 on the dollar, or even less sometimes, paid by other
11 Canadian broadcasters in many cases.
12 986 Coupled with the reality that ethnic
13 broadcasters are, despite reduced Cancon broadcast
14 obligations, spreading relatively few production
15 dollars over many productions, the type and quality of
16 ethnic programming has typically reflected the lower
17 production budgets involved.
18 987 Therefore, we respectfully make two
19 general recommendations in this area:
20 988 First, existing TV funding programs
21 must be encouraged to open up ethnic broadcaster
22 productions by removing the previously mentioned
23 restrictions, and;
24 989 Secondly, new ethnic program
25 production funding pools must be established.
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1 990 One speaker this evening mentioned
2 tax credits for corporate sponsorship of ethnic
3 programming and that strikes me as the genesis of a
4 good idea.
5 991 In closing, I would like to reiterate
6 the theme of what I am saying today. That there is a
7 clear public interest in protecting what ethnic
8 broadcasters like Telelatino have created to date.
9 992 TLN television broadcasts 24 hours
10 per day, seven days per week an incredible variety of
11 quality foreign and Canadian-produced programs. And
12 for all of this TLN receives less than $1 from the
13 average TLN subscribing household. That is $1 per
14 year.
15 993 We at Telelatino continue to pursue
16 expanding and improving our longstanding commitment to
17 the Canadian communities of Italian and Hispanic
18 origin. Telelatino is proudly Italian. Telelatino is
19 proudly Hispanic. We are also fiercely Canadian.
20 994 Thank you.
21 995 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
22 much, Mr. di Felice.
23 996 MS RHÉAUME: Our next speaker is mr.
24 Mario Bianchi, Vice-President of Laura Productions.
25 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
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1 997 MR. BIANCHI: Thank you, Madam Chair.
2 998 My name is Mario Bianchi,
3 Vice-President of Laura Productions, an independent
4 producer responsible for the show "You Decide", a
5 weekly program of Telelatino Network. This come 28th
6 of February, the show will complete five years of
7 programming.
8 999 Thanks to the opportunity that
9 Telelatino gives us, the Spanish-speaking community for
10 the first time in Canadian history can participate
11 freely and directly in a live show without censorship
12 in their own language.
13 1000 The show that is produced within a
14 Canadian context deals on a weekly basis with the
15 topics and situations that affect this community and
16 its development.
17 1001 The problems that are debated by the
18 members of the panel and the public are always topics
19 of importance that deal with the daily lives of this
20 immigrant population that faces difficulties in the
21 adjustment and settlement process in their new
22 homeland. These pertinent discussions give people an
23 awareness of where to find help or how widespread their
24 own problem might be.
25 1002 We have finally in this new season
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1 modified the show by representing the topic of debate
2 in a theatrical form, with the aim to promote the
3 theatre in the community and its actors at the same
4 time.
5 1003 Telelatino has made a financial
6 effort to produce this show with technical elements and
7 backgrounds in accordance with the large audience that
8 watch the show.
9 1004 Therefore, I would favour that our
10 "dear" channel could be extended without hindrances to
11 all the corners of Canada, without any slight or
12 smaller communities.
13 1005 Thank you so much.
14 1006 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
15 much, Mr. Bianchi. Thank you for being the most
16 succinct presenter we have had so far.
17 1007 MR. BIANCHI: yes.
18 1008 THE CHAIRPERSON: That's not to
19 suggest that we don't like the longer presentations,
20 but that was well done.
21 1009 No questions.
22 1010 Thank you.
23 1011 MS RHÉAUME: Our next speaker is ms
24 Magda de la Torre from CHIN-FM.
25 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
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1 1012 MS DE LA TORRE: I could try to cram
2 in 10 minutes five pages of arguments, statistics and
3 on-hand experience.
4 1013 I could try to learn in a few days
5 and repeat today the technical and business aspects
6 that my peers live and breath on a daily basis.
7 1014 Born in Cuba, I could also try to
8 convince the CRTC that Cuban Spanish is the best
9 language and that the Cubans need a 24 hour radio and
10 TV station.
11 1015 I will not do any of the three. My
12 message will be direct and hopefully short and sweet.
13 1016 My name is Magda de la Torre and I am
14 a double immigrant. I was born in Cuba and on my first
15 generation I experienced what it meant to live in a
16 complete totalitarian state.
17 1017 As a political refugee I landed in
18 the United States where I had to assimilate int he
19 melting pot existing there. I learned the science of
20 living in a place where the extremes are flaunted on a
21 constant basis.
22 1018 A generation later my work brought me
23 to Canada to experience a more tolerant society; a
24 country where life seemed slower and where compromise
25 was an integral part of society. This, ladies and
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1 gentlemen, is my Canada.
2 1019 As a resident of Canada I am able to
3 speak my mind in front of decision making government
4 executives and try to, in a few minutes, convince them
5 of the reality of my speech.
6 1020 Believe me when I say that as a first
7 generation ethnic it is my choice to reside in Canada.
8 1021 Multicultural, multiracial,
9 multilingual, heritage and culture are words that are
10 respected in a country like Canada.
11 1022 We ethnics are lucky to have a
12 regulated CRTC.
13 1023 As a professional my experiences are
14 a specialist and promoter in the Latin market. In
15 tourism, I represented the governments of Dominical
16 Republic, Virgin Islands, Costa Rica, Panama, American
17 Express and more.
18 1024 In media, for six years I was the
19 comptroller of a print media rep. For five years I
20 produced the No. 1 Spanish TV show in New york's
21 Telemundo. For the last three years we have arranged
22 the latin component of Canadian Music Week, bridging
23 and fostering the best of Canadian Latin talent. For
24 the last four years we have produced Spanish radio
25 shows, including the Mel Lastman Square event of Super
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1 Latin Fest, with over 60,000 people in 1998.
2 1025 I am the producer of "Toronto
3 Latino", CHIN's answer to the first and second
4 generation Spanish community. And, the co-producer of
5 Global Groove Network, an overnight program, also in
6 CHIN.
7 1026 My experience lets me zero in two
8 necessary issues. First issue, second and third
9 generation ethnics.
10 1027 Toronto with its 60 per cent plus of
11 ethnic penetration demands a diverse TV and radio
12 calendar. Today we have increasing new audiences of
13 second and third generation ethnics that have grown up
14 in our great multicultural fibre. While targeting
15 programs for Canada's multicultural reality; Canada
16 needs programs that encompasses the bridging from first
17 to second and third generations.
18 1028 Mainstream media, with very few
19 exceptions, does not pay attention to this increasing
20 growing audience. As an example, the music world.
21 Music has to diversify at a greater, faster mode to
22 serve the appetite of these audiences. Dance music
23 alone comes as pop, dance, hip hop, house, drum and
24 bass, Euro, jungle, garage, techno, disco, Latino, T
25 &B, rap, et cetera, et cetera.
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1 1029 Initially, market demands was one of
2 the reasons why most ethnic radio stations have chosen
3 to devote their schedules almost exclusively to first
4 generation programming, going over the general CRTC
5 requirement of a minimum of 60 per cent ethnic
6 programs.
7 1030 Radio stations could follow the
8 successful format of CFMT, targeting programs to the
9 second and third generations when audiences are more
10 likely to hear and within their 40 per cent licence
11 requirement.
12 1031 As a solution and an opportunity, our
13 company, the Media Group, has started over 60 hours of
14 overnight programs in CHIN-AM and FM, called GGN 1 and
15 2, The Bomb, filling the void in the marketplace for
16 second and third generation ethnics.
17 1032 Second, the lack of TV programming
18 for ethnics. The same market demands have not caused
19 the same effects with television stations. In
20 television the revenues are generated mostly by the
21 financial performance of approximately 40 per cent of
22 the broadcast week -- or "mainstream" programming.
23 1033 If financially viable, TV stations
24 wish to air more quality Cancon programs.
25 1034 The need for more cultural ethnic
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1 based programming can be fulfilled by way of new
2 subsidies and/or funding, grants, co-op, et cetera.
3 This will foster the production of Canadian content for
4 mainstream and ethnic broadcasters alike, thus allowing
5 broadcasters and producers to air and/or produce a
6 wider diversity of themes and characters representing
7 today's multicultural reality in the marketplace.
8 1035 When producing those programs our
9 goal has to be high production values and standard
10 formats to master the globalization and exporting of
11 the programs, thus achieving the financial success and
12 continuity of the productions. This needs to be
13 encouraged by policy and financial enforcement.
14 1036 On those bases, and like I promised
15 in a meeting held to talk about this CRTC public
16 consultation in Telefilm, I requested and got copies of
17 a cultural related production made by PBS, Public
18 Broadcasting System, in Miami 20 years ago and still
19 airs successfully in mainstream TV -- bridging the gap
20 between both communities, mainstream and ethnics, and
21 covering and making laugh three generations. We will
22 approach Telefilm via its newly and ethnic appointed
23 member. Elvira Sanchez.
24 1037 People, let's look for solutions.
25 Solutions is the answer. Let us do it together with a
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1 regulated CRTC. In this case, we cannot afford to
2 imitate the United States.
3 1038 When I see appointments like Elvira
4 Sanchez in Telefilm and Andrew Cardozo in the CRTC, I
5 have hope.
6 1039 Hear our spoken words and read our
7 written words. We already told you that to ethnics
8 this is not a dead issue. instead of one day, these
9 hearings have needed three days.
10 1040 Spanish people are blessed. With our
11 music we have crossed borders with media broadcasters.
12 With my roots being Spanish, together with a copy of my
13 speech, I am leaving for the CRTC Spanish music CDs.
14 Enjoy, dance and feel like an ethnic.
15 1041 I like to thank my peers for their
16 constant support, CHIN RADIO for airing our programs,
17 the CRTC for letting us speak our mind and, to
18 finalize, I like to thank the unique vision of Canada,
19 a country that dares to be different.
20 1042 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
21 much, Ms de la Torre. That was a very inspired and
22 impassioned presentation and I appreciate it.
23 1043 MS DE LA TORRE: It was passionate.
24 1044 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.
25 1045 MS RHÉAUME: Our next speaker is Mr.
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1 Lenny Lombardi, Executive Vice-President of CHIN
2 RADIO/TV International.
3 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
4 1046 MR. LOMBARDI: Good evening,
5 Commissioners, ladies and gentlemen. My name is Lenny
6 Lombardi and I am Vice-President of CHIN RADIO/TV
7 International.
8 1047 CHIN intends to file two written
9 submissions regarding the policy review. The first as
10 a licensed broadcaster of CHIN-AM 1540 and CHIN-FM
11 100.7 and the producer of 10 hours of multicultural
12 television programming and the second as a joint
13 submission as a participating member of the Canadian
14 Association of Ethnic Broadcasters.
15 1048 It is not my intention here to
16 reiterate the points to be contained in our written
17 submission, but instead I would like the opportunity to
18 reflect on the reality of CHIN and our hopes for the
19 future of ethnic broadcasting in Canada.
20 1049 CHIN RADIO broadcasts to over 30
21 distinct linguistic and cultural groups combined over
22 both our AM and FM frequencies. Licensed in 1966 CHIN
23 was one of the first Canadian radio stations authorized
24 to provide ethnic programming in Canada. But CHIN's
25 inception as a multilingual broadcast entity is
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1 predated by about 15 years when a young man, having
2 recently returned from overseas as a Sergeant in the
3 Canadian army believed that there was a need in Toronto
4 for radio programming in languages other than English
5 or French. He recognized the large influx of post-war
6 immigrants and in particular the italian immigrants,
7 who had no means of entertainment and information in
8 their own language.
9 1050 He then approached the new owner of
10 1050 CHUM, Allan Waters, and convinced him to sell some
11 of his air time for Italian programming. An idea
12 almost inconceivable, given that in those days it was
13 still illegal for languages other than the official to
14 be spoken on the public airwaves. But the two were
15 undaunted, the program went to air, the host speaking
16 English but playing italian songs. So was born the
17 humble beginnings of ethnic broadcasting, in a time
18 when it was a little more than "politically incorrect"
19 to broadcast in a foreign tongue, men with vision
20 persevered and seized the opportunity.
21 1051 The year was 1950 and the man was
22 Johnny Lombardi, founder and President of CHIN RADIO.
23 Some 15 years later, after having purchased air time
24 from almost every available station in the Toronto
25 market and, in some cases, forced to move his brand of
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1 programming from station to station like a nomad,
2 Johnny Lombardi would finally find a permanent home and
3 begin to build the station format we have today at
4 CHIN.
5 1052 CHIN RADIO became a haven for
6 independent producers and amateur broadcasters alike,
7 inviting all and giving opportunity to hone skills and
8 establish programming for their respective communities.
9 In those early days of broadcasting the objectives were
10 clear, get and maintain financial stability through
11 advertising, and serve the entertainment, information
12 and educational needs of our listeners. This has
13 always been and continues to be the primary role of
14 ethnic broadcasters.
15 1053 Today CHIN RADIO works hard to secure
16 producers and succeed in a competitive environment.
17 CHIN RADIO is in effect 30 stations and must be
18 sensitive to the needs of all our listeners. Each
19 program has a producer, program director, a sales rep,
20 a copy writer, a traffic co-ordinator and
21 administrator. Over 90 per cent of the revenue is
22 generated from the retail market, with very little
23 support coming from national advertisers. Ethnic
24 broadcasting is distinct, intensive and demanding.
25 1054 Ethnic programming on CHIN is
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1 strongly community based. Each program strives to
2 reflect the activities and aspirations of the community
3 it serves. The best example of radio support for
4 community can be seen in our CHIN International Picnic.
5 Celebrating our 34th year, the picnic is a
6 multicultural festival of music and cultural expression
7 produced exclusively by CHIN and is the showcasing and
8 expression of the many multicultural communities that
9 thrive in our city and is supported by our station's
10 programming.
11 1055 Held each year on the Canada Day
12 weekend, the world's largest free international picnic
13 attracts over 250,000 people, features over 1,000
14 multicultural entertainers performing on three stages
15 running concurrently throughout the weekend. Born from
16 the idea of a simple celebration 34 years ago, the
17 picnic has blossomed into a world class event that
18 proudly demonstrates and celebrates the rich cultural
19 diversity of Toronto and of Canada.
20 1056 CHIN RADIO is TV as well. CHIN has
21 been producing multicultural programs for Toronto TV
22 since 1970. Starting out at CKVR in Barrie, and then
23 on to Global, CHIN found its home on CityTV. We have
24 been proudly broadcasting 10 hours of international
25 programs to 12 distinct linguistic and cultural groups
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1 on CityTV since the early eighties. CityTV is to be
2 commended for their unfailing dedication to the
3 preservation of cultural identity. Since their
4 inception, City Television has always included ethnic
5 programming as part of their schedule, recognizing even
6 then the unique cultural makeup of Toronto. We are
7 proud of our longstanding association with CityTV and
8 continue to look forward to providing quality ethnic
9 programming through them, each and every week.
10 1057 Fourteen years have passed since the
11 implementation of the ethnic policy in 1985. In this
12 rapidly changing environment we as broadcasters have
13 new and exciting challenges on the horizon.
14 1058 The evolution and integration of some
15 ethnic communities is well under way. The second and
16 third generation members of those communities are
17 letting their voices be heard and the message we hear
18 is that language based Type A programs do not serve the
19 entire community as well as it once did. Within some
20 communities Type C and D programming might be more
21 attractive, but caution must be exercised. no
22 broadcaster wants to rush to serve one at the expense
23 of another. Preserving audience while expanding
24 listenership will be a formidable challenge.
25 1059 Ethnic broadcasters in radio all try
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1 to comply with the amount of Canadian content required,
2 but can only do so by creating the product themselves.
3 CHIN annually produces music festivals and records
4 segments of the CHIN picnic and other cultural events
5 for both radio and television as a means of showcasing
6 ethno-Canadian culture. This is costly and labour
7 intensive. Ways in which to harness the tremendous
8 talent within the cultural communities and additional
9 means in which to stimulate the record industry to
10 respond to this wealth of talent needs to be explored.
11 Ethnic radio alone cannot adequately support the
12 Canadian content requirements across the board in every
13 language group. Any increase without additional
14 measures in place would be a burden.
15 1060 In conclusion, the multicultural
16 nature of Canada is on the increase due to immigration.
17 According to StatsCan 1996, the rate of immigrants
18 reporting a mother tongue other than English and French
19 grew two and a half times faster than the overall
20 growth rate of the Canadian population. In Toronto,
21 the most ethnically diverse city in Canada, according
22 to StatsCan, states that 33 per cent of the total
23 population speaks a language other than English or
24 French in the home. Canada and Toronto has never been
25 more multicultural and multilingual than today.
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1 1061 The main objective of the ethnic
2 broadcaster is to provide entertainment, information
3 and educational needs of our multilingual listeners.
4 Reflecting the cultural diversity of Canada to all
5 Canadians is a shared responsibility of each and every
6 broadcaster. We support the initiatives that encourage
7 all broadcasters to reflect that reality to all
8 Canadians. We discovered years ago the joy of
9 celebrating our cultural differences as proud
10 Canadians. We want to continue to spread that
11 important message.
12 1062 Thank you for this opportunity to
13 present our views and we look forward to participating
14 further through the written submission phase of this
15 review. Thank you.
16 1063 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
17 much, Mr. Lombardi.
18 1064 Madam Secretary.
19 1065 MS RHÉAUME: We will now hear a
20 presentation by Mr. Sher Singh.
21 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
22 1066 MR. SINGH: Thank you.
23 1067 Madam Commissioner, Mr. Commissioner,
24 I should state at the outset I am not a producer or an
25 owner or in any way associated with any TV or radio
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1 channel. I am here to speak as a consumer, as one who
2 stands where the rubber hits the road. I do not
3 represent any organization or any group. I am here to
4 speak only on my behalf.
5 1068 Four points I would like to make and
6 if I may summarize them at the outset. First of all, I
7 believe that the test of what should be done or should
8 not be done, the touchstone against which everything
9 should be rubbed is does it help new Canadians and
10 their children? Does it help children of different
11 backgrounds in becoming full-fledged Canadians, fully
12 productive Canadians part of mainstream Canada?
13 1069 If that test is met, then what we are
14 doing, what we are deciding not to do, I would suggest,
15 would point us in the right direction.
16 1070 The second point I would like to make
17 is the more well-grounded a person, a citizen is in his
18 or her past, the more easily he or she is able to move
19 into the future. It is important to understand that
20 what ethnic programming, third-language programming is
21 doing is helping new Canadians and their children,
22 those people who are in the process of becoming
23 full-fledged participants in Canada to get well
24 grounded, so that they can move forward into new
25 territory. They can only do so and benefit from it and
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1 achieve the optimum result if they are fully confident
2 of themselves, of their past, of their heritage, of
3 their traditions, of their language, of their
4 ethnicity, et cetera.
5 1071 The third point I would like to make
6 is that we have to be careful that we don't create
7 ghettos. The system works the same way as we would in
8 housing. Would it benefit this society or any group or
9 Canada as a whole if in housing we create ghettos where
10 certain communities are segregated because it is more
11 convenient, for that particular group or other groups,
12 that it be done so? I would suggest that our
13 experience has taught us that that is not so. My
14 suggestion would be that we do not isolate ethnic
15 programming or programming directed to the immediate
16 benefit of new Canadians or immigrants away from
17 mainstream, to the point that it creates a new ghetto
18 and does not permit any interaction between mainstream
19 Canada and new Canadians who are preoccupied in
20 becoming part of the larger community.
21 1072 Finally, I would like to suggest that
22 what we have been doing in the last decade or so is
23 working. All we need to do is fine-tune it, strengthen
24 it, see how we can take it further, how we can develop
25 it, how we can build on it, rather than change the
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1 direction completely or dismantle what we are doing or
2 derail it completely for some reason or other.
3 1073 I should add that I came to this
4 country as a 20-year old about 30 years ago and the
5 first 15 years or so were extremely distressing in
6 terms of ethnic programming, third-language
7 programming. It was trash, particularly in the
8 languages that I speak, but I am aware of the quality
9 that generally was available to other communities, to
10 other language groups and I am sure there were
11 exceptions, but generally there was a problem.
12 1074 I think the problem related to a
13 number of factors; one, that the numbers in many of the
14 communities did not justify more expense, more
15 investment in such shows. Two, many of the communities
16 had not been here long enough and had not attained
17 maturity, et cetera, and, third, possibly as a result
18 of the second point, there was dependency on old
19 country programming, stuff that was not only imported,
20 but ensured that new Canadians remained tied to their
21 past and could not move forward in any particular
22 manner. That has changed drastically in the last 10
23 years and I have noticed that the programming has taken
24 a giant leap forward. The quality has improved to the
25 point that it often, more often than not, matches
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1 mainstream programming in quality and the impact it has
2 on the communities.
3 1075 I would suggest that we work along
4 those lines and see what is working, what is having the
5 maximum impact on the communities and strengthen that.
6 1076 I want to give one example of an
7 exercise I was involved in in the last two years. The
8 Sikh community in 1997 celebrated 100 years in Canada.
9 It was the centennial of the first Sikh settlement in
10 1897.
11 1077 We struggled with what should we do
12 with it. Should we do some shows on our ethnic and
13 Punjabi-language programs, et cetera, et cetera. We
14 came to the conclusion that the best way of going about
15 commemorating that was to do it by including all
16 generations within the community, whether they were
17 new, second, third, fourth generation or those who have
18 just stepped off the boat or the plane, as well as the
19 community at large.
20 1078 I should say that one type of program
21 that was produced by CFMT was, oddly enough, entirely
22 in the English language. It was done from beginning to
23 the end in English, directed to the community and ended
24 up being not only a very useful tool within the
25 community, but outside the Sikh community as well and
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1 was received with incredible support. Not one negative
2 response was received indicating why wasn't it in the
3 third language, et cetera, et cetera.
4 1079 That exercise was so successful, it
5 was an unprecedented attempt on the part of CFMT to try
6 something of that sort. It was so successful that it
7 was repeated the following year and I understand it
8 will be repeated further.
9 1080 My suggestion would be that there be
10 something inculcated to encourage communities to move
11 in that direction. I understand now that if
12 programming is done in English, if it is done in ways
13 that move away from third-language use, then it doesn't
14 fall within certain categories and I know you have
15 certain quotas and requirements. I understand there is
16 a category where if it is done in English it doesn't
17 fall within the ethnic quota required, et cetera, et
18 cetera.
19 1081 My suggestion would be that there be
20 encouragement of two kinds; one, ethnic shows,
21 third-language shows be encouraged on their own -- on
22 their own free will voluntarily as the needs of the
23 community changes. For example, the needs of the older
24 communities, whether they are Ukrainian, Italian,
25 German, et cetera, are different from the new
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1 communities that have arrived in this country in the
2 last 10 years. Leave it to them to determine what are
3 the needs of their communities.
4 1082 For example, I look at my own family,
5 three generations of them living here. My parents came
6 with some English, learned some more English,
7 nevertheless they speak English with a heavy accent. I
8 speak with minimal accent and I am able to get by with
9 facility in the language. My daughter was born here
10 and does not speak with any accent and can fit into any
11 group without any suggestion that she has an accent or
12 does not fit in, et cetera, et cetera. This has
13 happened through evolution. It has happened through
14 evolution and, therefore, whatever forces that
15 permitted that sort of a thing to happen should be
16 encouraged. We need to understand that ethnic
17 programming, third-language programming in fact
18 encourages new Canadians to become fully productive
19 Canadians, 100 per cent Canadians.
20 1083 If we assist that, if we take
21 ownership of it, if the CRTC regulates it and keeps
22 ownership of it, it will carry on doing what is
23 absolutely essential for the growth of this country.
24 1084 The second point I would like to make
25 in that regard is that we need to encourage mainstream
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1 channels, stations and programming, to have the type of
2 programming that I mentioned. The show that I was
3 referring to was "Sutstri Ecol" (ph), produced by CFMT
4 in the English language to commemorate an ethnic event
5 which essentially should be of interest and is of
6 interest to 100 per cent of Canadians. It was a
7 celebration of an event which needs to be understood
8 and commemorated and celebrated by everybody and was.
9 1085 If we do not encourage mainstream
10 channels and stations to participate in that, that sort
11 of activity where they move into areas where the needs
12 of all segments of the community are met, if we do not
13 do so, then we are not only creating ghettos within the
14 industry, but as well we are permitting mainstream
15 channels and shows and stations to increasingly cater
16 to an ever decreasing population, ever decreasing
17 market and it does not serve the purpose of the
18 community at large that that should happen.
19 1086 Those are all the points I need to
20 make.
21 1087 Thank you.
22 1088 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
23 much, Mr. Singh, and thank you for taking the time to
24 be with us.
25 1089 MR. SINGH: My pleasure.
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1 1090 MS RHÉAUME: The next presenter is
2 Mr. Ben Viccari, President of the Canadian Ethnic
3 Journalists' and Writers' Club.
4 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
5 1091 MR. VICCARI: Madam Commissioner, Mr.
6 Commissioner, ladies and gentlemen, my name is Ben
7 Viccari and I would like to thank you for the
8 opportunity of addressing you on behalf of the Canadian
9 Ethnic journalists' and Writers' Club, of which I am
10 the current President.
11 1092 I am also managing editor of Canadian
12 Scene, a non-profit multilingual news and information
13 service for Canada's ethnic media and a television
14 commentator on CFMT television. You will be hearing
15 from the President of Canadian Scene, Mr. John Oostrom,
16 at tomorrow's consultations.
17 1093 The Canadian Ethnic Journalists' and
18 Writers' Club is an inclusive organization of print and
19 broadcast media people: from freelance writers to
20 reporters, to editors, to publishers, founded on
21 democratic principles 21 years ago by the late Sierhey
22 Khmara Ziniak, editor/publisher of the Byelorussian
23 Voice. Existing ethnic media associations up to that
24 time had been exclusively for print media and
25 membership was confined to publishers.
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1 1094 Incidentally, I was very pleased to
2 see that 11 of our members have shown up here tonight.
3 1095 The Club has never sought financial
4 support from any government with the exception of a
5 one-time, partial funding by the federal and ontario
6 governments of an anthology of members' writings 13
7 years ago.
8 1096 We hold monthly speakers' meetings
9 and two celebratory dinners a year, one: to
10 commemorate, collectively, joyous festivals such as
11 Christmas, Hanukkah, Diwali, Ramadhan and the Chinese
12 New Year, and one to present nine journalism awards.
13 Our speakers in recent times have included the Hon.
14 Hedy Fry, Secretary of State for Multiculturalism and
15 the Status of Women, the Hon. Mike Harris, Premier of
16 Ontario, Mr. Dalton McGuinty, leader of the Ontario
17 Liberal Party, His Excellency Rajanikanta Verma, the
18 High Commissioner of India, and CRTC Commissioner Mr.
19 Andrew Cardozo, who urged members of ethnocultural
20 communities to communicate with the Commission when
21 issues affecting them arise. That his message was well
22 received has, I think, been well demonstrated by the
23 fact that these Toronto consultations have been
24 extended from a single day to three.
25 1097 We, the Club, vigorously support the
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1 rights of ethnic journalists to free expression in the
2 language of their choice with a special emphasis on
3 interpreting Canada to new Canadians and not-so-new
4 Canadians to whom the mother tongue is still the
5 language of comfort, however fluent they may be in
6 English.
7 1098 We are currently engaged in
8 developing a strategy to communicate the fact that we
9 are professionals and as such and because of our
10 ability to further the cause of good citizenship we
11 deserve greater recognition by mainstream institutions
12 in the form of invitations to their news conferences
13 and other events.
14 1099 I use the term "mainstream" to
15 indicate what is today a rather blurry dividing line
16 between the "us" or the majority of citizens and "then"
17 members of a large number of ethnic minorities in
18 Toronto in particular where, collectively, minorities
19 will soon become the majority.
20 1100 I would like first to present what I
21 believe to be our members' views on third-language
22 communications. We know that, according to the 1996
23 census, there were in this country some 4.9 million
24 people whose mother tongue was neither English nor
25 French and that 2.8 million of these still used the
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1 mother tongue at home. This is particularly true of
2 large urban areas, particularly Toronto with 25 per
3 cent using the mother tongue at home and Vancouver with
4 22 per cent.
5 1101 Now, judging by the increasing number
6 of people who, annually, seek Canadian citizenship one
7 can safely assume that while to so many the language of
8 comfort is a third language, they are eager to know
9 more and more about Canadian customs, history, law
10 politics and the rights and responsibilities of
11 citizenship.
12 1102 The three-way information partnership
13 of print, radio and television is therefore vital as a
14 means of satisfying these needs, and it is the opinion
15 of members of this Club that in this sense, while the
16 present broadcasting system is partially serving
17 ethnocultural communities, even more ethnic programming
18 of Canadian content would be welcome and that the
19 Commission should do all it can to encourage the growth
20 of such programming. We see it as an important
21 corollary of good citizenship and, therefore, of nation
22 building.
23 1103 This, we believe, should not
24 necessarily imply that the importation of some foreign
25 programs on existing TV facilities be proscribed any
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1 more than the right of public broadcasters such as
2 TV-Ontario to import British programming should be
3 removed.
4 1104 The national policy of
5 multiculturalism proclaimed in 1971 became codified
6 with an Act of Parliament in 1988, and we are therefore
7 looking at almost 30 years in which Canadians of all
8 origins have been encouraged to cherish their heritages
9 as well as to become model Canadian citizens. In
10 Canada, the two go hand in hand and the eyes of the
11 world are on Canadian multiculturalism with envy for
12 the way in which we people of so many different origins
13 are living together side by side.
14 1105 We cannot deny that discrimination
15 and racism still exist here, but nevertheless while we
16 can always recognize the fact that there is room for
17 improvement, we can at least pride ourselves on the
18 distance we have come in Canada. And I think we owe a
19 lot to ethnic programming for that.
20 1106 In conclusion, we would like to touch
21 on what the Commission terms Type E programming. We
22 firmly believe that programs of an ethnocultural nature
23 in French or English directed to any ethnic group or
24 groups or to a mainstream audience that further an
25 understanding of multiculturalism are of a highly
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1 desirable nature and should be considered ethnic
2 programming when they are broadcast by ethnic stations.
3 It is also a very good idea to try to promote, as some
4 people have suggested here tonight, multicultural
5 programming on mainstream stations.
6 1107 In conclusion, Commissioners,
7 speaking for members of the Canadian Ethnic
8 Journalists' and Writers' Club, I trust that the
9 Commission will discern the vast potential toward
10 nation building offered by ethnic broadcasting and
11 encourage its continuance and growth. May I
12 congratulate you on these consultations which we are
13 convinced will lead to even greater harmony and
14 understanding between all Canadians.
15 1108 Thank you.
16 1109 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
17 much, Mr. Viccari.
18 1110 MS RHÉAUME: The next presenter is Ms
19 Cecilia Mar, producer of Chinese programs on CHIN
20 RADIO/TV International.
21 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
22 1111 MS MAR: Good evening, Commissioners,
23 ladies and gentlemen. My name is Cecilia Mar and I am
24 the producer of CHIN RADIO/TV International Chinese
25 programs.
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1 1112 Upon my graduation from the
2 University of Southern California in Los Angeles in
3 1988, my family and I have come to Toronto -- have
4 moved to Toronto that same year. including my
5 schooling in the United States, have been residing in
6 North America of close to 19 years. My broadcasting
7 career started in 1990 when I joined CHIN Radio Chinese
8 Program as a part-time announcer. At that time there
9 were only a total of 10 hours of Chinese programming at
10 CHIN per week, but over the years with the tremendous
11 increase of the Chinese population in Toronto, the CHIN
12 Chinese programming has now been increased to a seven
13 days' broadcast of a total of 46 hours of Chinese radio
14 programming per week.
15 1113 Before I continue my presentation
16 tonight, I would like to, first of all, first of all,
17 read to all of you three letters that were written to
18 the CHIN Chinese Program by fellow listeners. All
19 three letters were written in Chinese and I have
20 translated them in English and summarized them as
21 follows. Letter number one is written by Mr. Ng who is
22 an immigrant from China and has come to Toronto about a
23 year ago.
24 1114 Due to his lack of communication
25 skills in English it was hard for him to adapt to the
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1 Canadian lifestyle at the beginning. By listening to
2 our radio programming he is able to get access to the
3 daily essential information, such as the community
4 news, daily news from back home and other types of
5 informative programs.
6 1115 He is currently renting an apartment
7 in Toronto and recently he has been having problems
8 with his landlord, which by listening to our law
9 program on every Thursday night he was able to make his
10 inquiry over the phone through our speaker host, one of
11 the Chinese litigation lawyers. His problems were
12 solved and besides writing to compliment our radio
13 programming, he also wanted to express his thanks to
14 our station for allowing him the opportunity to have
15 his inquiries answered.
16 1116 He also wants to show us his
17 appreciation on how the Chinese programming helped him
18 in his daily life.
19 1117 Letter number two is written by Mr.
20 Jonathan Chen who is a student from Hong Kong. He has
21 been in Canada for a year now. He has decided to
22 further his education in Toronto and at first, like
23 letter number one from Mr. Ng, life was just as
24 difficult for him due to the lack of acquaintances, as
25 well as that he is not familiar with the area.
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1 1118 On one occasion he was introduced to
2 the Chinese radio programming which he began to like
3 very much, to a point where he is now a regular
4 listener of our radio programming.
5 1119 Besides again, he wants to show his
6 appreciation to the CHIN Chinese program for the
7 quality programming that we have provided and the
8 essential information which as a newcomer he
9 appreciates a great deal.
10 1120 There are also other inquiries that
11 he wishes to make and wishes to obtain answers from us
12 about his schooling. There are questions. To
13 summarize, these questions about -- they are mainly
14 pertaining to questions in terms of the application for
15 university admission.
16 1121 Letter number three was written by
17 Mr. Ho and his family who have come to Canada for 17
18 years now and who is also a long time loyal listener to
19 the CHIN Chinese radio program.
20 1122 By radio programming it is possible
21 for him to receive the latest news and happenings from
22 back home. English being the second language,
23 therefore, the Chinese radio broadcast plays a very
24 important part in their daily lives. His children are
25 born and raised in Toronto, but through the Chinese
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1 radio broadcasts they can retain their knowledge in
2 their own culture and continue to practise to speak
3 their mother tongue, Chinese.
4 1123 Furthermore, the station organizes a
5 number of cultural events throughout the year, such as
6 the CHIN International Picnic at the CNE and Canada's
7 Wonderland Chinese Festival. These type of events are
8 not only entertaining, but it is also a fabulous
9 gathering to promote the cultural diversity.
10 1124 I will include the letters that I
11 have mentioned previously in my written submissions to
12 the CRTC later on.
13 1125 The above-mentioned letters are
14 classic examples which these type of letters we receive
15 on a regular basis. People from different age groups,
16 social and educational backgrounds who have different
17 needs to rely on Chinese radio broadcasts. The three
18 classic examples that I have provided basically dissect
19 our listeners into three categories: the younger
20 listeners, the newly arrived and the established
21 Canadians of Chinese heritage.
22 1126 The three categories of listeners
23 have three common needs out of ethnic cultural radio
24 programming and they also present the three main
25 objectives in which our radio program is produced.
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1 1127 Number one, to introduce Canadian
2 culture to the new arrivals.
3 1128 Number two, to help the newly arrived
4 or established immigrants to retain their own culture.
5 1129 Number three, to bridge the gap
6 between the mainstream society and the ethnic
7 community.
8 1130 In conclusion, the CHIN Chinese radio
9 programming receives its support mainly from our
10 community. Revenue is generated to sustain the
11 operation through retail advertisers within our
12 community. Support from the mainstream society is also
13 obtained by national advertisers, although it has still
14 not yet reached the extent that we would like it to be.
15 1131 As the producer of the CHIN Chinese
16 program, I would like to extend my thanks to the CRTC
17 for granting us the opportunity for ethnic cultural
18 programming and to allow myself the opportunity to
19 pursue my own career in the field that I enjoy very
20 much. Our existence has definitely helped both the
21 Chinese community and the mainstream society to grow
22 together for a better and prosperous Canada.
23 1132 Thank you.
24 1133 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
25 much, Ms Mar, and we would like to extend our thanks to
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1 you for being with us.
2 1134 MS MAR: Thank you.
3 1135 MS RHÉAUME: Our next speaker is Mr.
4 John Zarrinmehr. Mr. John Zarrinmehr.
5 1136 Mr. Bill Yancoff, producer for the
6 Macedonian Heritage TV program on CFMT-TV.
7 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
8 1137 MR. YANCOFF: Madames et messieurs,
9 honourable members of the Canadian Radio-television and
10 Telecommunications Commission. It is a great honour to
11 be able to address you regarding the CRTC's review on
12 its policy vis-à-vis third language and ethnic
13 programming.
14 1138 Mnogu sum gord shto sekoya sabota
15 preku televiziskata programa, Makedonski Koreni,
16 prenesuvame vazhni novini za zhivotot vo Kanada.
17 1139 I'm very proud that every Saturday on
18 the Macedonian Heritage television program we bring our
19 viewers important news about life in Canada.
20 1140 As we do every Saturday morning on
21 CFMT-TV, Channel 47 in Toronto, and as we have been
22 doing since CFMT's inception, I addressed you in the
23 Macedonian language.
24 1141 One of the Commission's questions is,
25 "Should there be a priority on the development of
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1 Canadian ethnocultural services rather than importing
2 foreign services?"
3 1142 Absolutely! Speaking in a third
4 language within a Canadian context enables the
5 Macedonian community and others to receive up-to-date
6 information on life in Canada in Macedonian. It
7 promotes family issues, solid Canadian citizenship and
8 the very ideals that make Canada second to none in the
9 world. it also assists in language retention, which in
10 my case stimulated me to learn the macedonian literary
11 language. Canadian business and government delegations
12 now actively recruit third language speakers to benefit
13 Canadian trade and commerce.
14 1143 Not only do we assist the integration
15 of new Canadians into Canadian society with
16 third-language programming, there are a number of other
17 benefits. Over the past 10 years as producer of the
18 show, I have seen a number of positive developments on
19 a wide range of Canadian-based issues, presenting
20 information in the macedonian language, one of 19
21 languages promoted on CFMT-TV.
22 1144 Regular interviews with
23 representatives of the police and all levels of
24 government enable our viewers to understand the rules
25 and regulations of the land, along with a chance to
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1 voice their opinions and make inquiries from
2 information presented on these segments. We also have
3 presented important information regarding issues such
4 as immigration, health and welfare concerns, the
5 Canadian census and a wide variety of other topics.
6 1145 Promoting Macedonian language and
7 culture greatly adds to the ethnocultural mosaic of
8 this country and assists in the retention of one's
9 heritage within a Canadian context. I'm a vivid
10 example of that. Born in Canada, it was an interview
11 on the Macedonian program on CFMT-TV in 1984, about a
12 Macedonian cultural extravaganza at Roy Thomson Hall,
13 Oro Makedonsko, that made me interested in learning
14 more about my heritage and about defining myself as a
15 Canadian of Macedonian origin, and how I could share
16 this rich culture with others.
17 1146 To answer another of your queries,
18 the present broadcasting system does adequately serve
19 Canada's ethnocultural communities.
20 Macedonian-Canadians and others from across the
21 Province of Ontario tune into our show on a regular
22 basis and, in some cases, respond en masse to
23 humanitarian issues presented on our show. those in
24 need like Suzana Kazakova, a 21-year old Canadian of
25 Macedonian descent, who needs a bone marrow transplant,
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1 received thousands of calls from blood donors, thanks
2 to our show and message in Macedonian.
3 1147 Many of those viewers were from
4 Croatia, from Bulgaria, Yugoslavia. They responded
5 because they could understand Macedonian, which reveals
6 a cross-cultural benefit of third-language programming.
7 There hasn't been a match yet for Suzana, but we will
8 continue to promote her cause on the show and,
9 hopefully, a match will be found soon.
10 1148 It would be very advantageous for
11 CFMT-TV to broadcast nationally, so that we could
12 promote Canadian issues and Macedonian culture across
13 the country. Viewers from outside Ontario regularly
14 inquire about the possibility of Macedonian Heritage
15 being aired in B.C. or Quebec or Alberta. I urge the
16 Commission to consider the enhancement of Canadian
17 unity and cultural diversity that such a network would
18 most certainly provide.
19 1149 Responding to another of the
20 Commission's questions, I believe that if we were to
21 solely import foreign services, we would not be
22 promoting Canadian ideals to our citizens. It may
23 create disunity among some ethnocultural groups. Some
24 countries promote ideals that are contrary to Canada's,
25 and may not be as understanding and accepting as those
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1 in this country, which are entrenched in government
2 legislation and relate to human rights and freedoms
3 that we sometimes take for granted.
4 1150 The CRTC's present policy adequately
5 serves Canadians of all ethnic backgrounds. It helps
6 promote harmony among all Canadians because it provides
7 access to all ethnocultural communities, not just the
8 most populous groups that bring in the most revenue.
9 To alter this policy would be a form of discrimination
10 and would make ethnic programming exclusive, rather
11 than the current policy of the Commission that has
12 worked so well for so many years. We urge you to
13 continue to provide third-language services to
14 Canadians of all backgrounds.
15 1151 Macedonian-Canadians thank you for
16 the opportunity to watch Macedonian-language
17 programming. Like some ethnocultural groups, our
18 macedonian language and culture are not promoted and as
19 accessible in some countries as they are in Canada,
20 which is a model for multicultural unity. Hopefully,
21 Macedonian Heritage will be aired one day from coast to
22 coast on CFMT-TV, which is perhaps the greatest success
23 story of Canadian multiculturalism to date.
24 1152 Vi blagodarime za vasheto ceneto
25 vnimanie.
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1 1153 I thank you for your attention.
2 1154 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
3 much, Mr. Yancoff.
4 1155 MS RHÉAUME: Our next speaker is Dr.
5 Colin Maloney, Executive Director for the Catholic
6 Children's Aid Society.
7 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
8 1156 DR. MALONEY: Thank you.
9 1157 Being Executive Director of a
10 mainstream agency that serves over 12,000 families a
11 year, with staff able to deliver services in 43
12 different languages, I just came to affirm to the CRTC
13 the issue for us is that ethnic television and radio
14 have been great partners to us. Stations like
15 Telelatino and CHIN not just have the linguistic
16 ability as you could import from anywhere, but to
17 engage with us as true partners.
18 1158 It is impressive with us that as we
19 try to reach and form and teach in a preventive way the
20 Canadian issues of child welfare, of parenting, of
21 difficulties, as we try to recruit foster homes for
22 children that are in need from various communities,
23 these stations have been willing to reach out with us
24 in partnership. It is far beyond just having something
25 in their own language. We have found these stations to
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1 be truly close to their communities, concerned of their
2 issues and willing to be truly public servants with us
3 as a mainstream agency, that I think it's just as a
4 value I want to be here tonight to ensure that that
5 partnership, that community based and that public
6 service that I have felt are not lost just because some
7 other -- from a linguistic point of view.
8 1159 We would be, as a mainstream agency,
9 impoverished if that were to change drastically.
10 1160 Thank you very much.
11 1161 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
12 much, Dr. Maloney.
13 1162 MS RHÉAUME: Our next speaker is Ms
14 Nellie Pedro.
15 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
16 1163 MS PEDRO: Good evening. Thank you
17 very much for the opportunity.
18 1164 First of all, I would like to say
19 that I consider myself to be an ethnic Canadian, in the
20 same way that there is French-Canadian,
21 English-Canadian. I think it would be of importance to
22 ethnic groups to be classified as ethnic Canadians.
23 1165 My name is Nellie pedro. I am the
24 co-producer and host of "Gente da Nossa" a Type A TV
25 program in the Portuguese language. "Gente da Nossa,"
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1 translated means "Our People". It is part of the CHIN
2 RADIO and TV ethnic programming broadcasting on one of
3 the mainstream television stations CityTV, Channel 7.
4 I hope that my presentation here today will reflect the
5 importance of having independent programming done, as
6 well as mainstream stations providing air time to these
7 particular programming.
8 1166 Allow me to give you a condensed
9 history of "Gente da Nossa". Caesar pedro is the
10 original producer who began the program in 1987 on
11 Graham Cable.
12 1167 The program is 99 per cent portuguese
13 Canadian content. We keep our audience informed and
14 entertained by providing images of activities organized
15 by our clubs and associations. We provide video clips
16 of local artists, interviews to educators, labourers,
17 union representatives, doctors, politicians, musicians,
18 artists, painters, successful businesses, entrepreneurs
19 and role models of our community.
20 1168 We take our cameras to cover events
21 in the portuguese communities in Ontario such as
22 Mississauga, Brampton, Hamilton, Cambridge, London,
23 Sarnia, Ottawa, Leamington, Windsor, Kingston. We have
24 gone to other communities in provinces such as -- well,
25 in Montreal, St. John's, Newfoundland, Calgary, Bermuda
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1 and various parts of the United States, the Continent,
2 Portugal, Madeira and the Azores.
3 1169 After volunteering our time to the
4 program since 1987, we have to date produced 564 shows;
5 40 of which were live call in shows. Just to liven
6 things up, I would like us all to watch them now. No.
7 Okay.
8 1170 In September of 1997 we joined Chin's
9 multicultural programming on CityTV. We took on the
10 financial responsibility of producing a commercial
11 program for our community. We have obtained sponsors,
12 generated advertising dollars, and are able to provide
13 revenue to pay for our air time to CHIN RADIO and
14 CityTV.
15 1171 We know we are producing a program
16 which is unique, informative, educational, entertaining
17 and this all due to the feedback from hundreds of phone
18 calls and letters that we receive from our viewers. I
19 would like to add that the viewers of Portuguese
20 language programming, such as our own, is not just
21 Portuguese-speaking people. We have, and I have
22 letters which will be followed, from native Canadians
23 that watch the program and in one particular case a
24 native Canadian that lives in Bath, Ontario wrote to me
25 and sent me an Indian prayer and he specifically said
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1 that he doesn't understand what I am saying, but he
2 enjoys the smile. And not only that, but he enjoys the
3 music as well and he is learning about my culture as he
4 hopes the rest of Canada learns about his.
5 1172 We have a lot of Italian people that
6 watch our program as well.
7 1173 On "Gente da Nossa" our priority is
8 to promote the Portuguese community in a positive
9 manner. We provide air time to those that cannot get
10 air time on other Portuguese television programs.
11 1174 As an example, recently we had a
12 guest that was a victim of a pedophile. After his
13 abuser was convicted of two counts of sexual
14 molestation to a minor, the victim wanted to go on TV
15 to tell his story and to warn parents about the signs
16 to look for and how to protect their children from such
17 people.
18 1175 According to him, he contacted all
19 the Portuguese language programs and no one would touch
20 the subject. We did. We gave him plenty of time.
21 Perhaps the reason is that I have seven-year old and it
22 is important to provide the information to other
23 parents. I believe that if this story was not told in
24 the Portuguese language the majority of the community
25 and of the audience, and especially the mothers, would
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1 not have the proper information to protect their
2 children from such people as pedophiles.
3 1176 Another example of the importance of
4 the program that we provide, as well as independent
5 productions, is the fact that we had for the first time
6 a wife abuser who wanted to come on. He is a
7 recovering abuser of family assault and wife assault
8 and he wanted to come on to tell and encourage other
9 men that this was wrong, that this was not right and
10 that they should seek help and that help is available
11 and that they could be cured. We provided the air time
12 for him to come on and do so. We interviewed him in
13 Portuguese and it was extremely important and one of
14 the programs that we had a lot of phone calls and a lot
15 of mail from because of its social impact in the
16 community. For the first time, a man was willing to
17 speak and we were willing to put him on TV and hear
18 him.
19 1177 We provide the air time and did --
20 1178 If the CRTC policy did not allow
21 mainstream television stations to provide ethnic
22 programming in Types A and D without prior Commission
23 approval, I would not be able to provide my show to the
24 community.
25 1179 I urge the Commission to encourage
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1 conventional television stations to be more culturally
2 sensitive. Provide the 15 per cent of their weekly
3 programming schedule permitted, either Type A to D, or
4 to produce their own Type E programs directed at ethnic
5 groups, depicting Canada's diversity through programs
6 that are multicultural, educational, informational and
7 intercultural in nature.
8 1180 I am requesting that 15 per cent of
9 the weekly programming on mainstream stations is
10 realistic, considering that in Toronto alone
11 approximately 33 per cent of the residents report the
12 exclusive use in the house of a language other than
13 French or English.
14 1181 I just want to tell you a little bit
15 about my particular community. We have different
16 numbers than Statistics Canada. According to our
17 community, we have approximately 750,000 Portuguese
18 Canadians, 500,000 in Ontario, 220,000 in the Toronto
19 area, 96,000 in Mississauga and Brampton and the
20 remaining are in southwestern Ontario, Ottawa,
21 Kingston, as well as northern Ontario, including
22 Sudbury. I also have had calls from Baffin Island,
23 from six Portuguese that are working in a lounge there
24 that watch my show, so that's great. I need those six
25 viewers.
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1 1182 The Portuguese in Toronto make up 2.3
2 per cent of the population by mother tongue. It's the
3 third largest non-English group in the Greater Toronto
4 Area after the Chinese and Italian and the Portuguese
5 have been in Canada since the 1950s. Eighty-five per
6 cent of Portuguese Canadians view programs in their
7 mother tongue.
8 1183 I do not see the need for the CRTC to
9 provide protection to licensees of ethnic television
10 stations by placing a ceiling of no more than 10 per
11 cent allowed of ethnic programming on their weekly
12 schedules to television stations in the same market.
13 Since it is permitted up to 15 per cent, it is not
14 encouraging to see the CRTC places a cap of 10 per cent
15 in order to protect ethnic stations.
16 1184 It is difficult to believe the claim
17 that the bulk of the revenue that ethnic television
18 stations generate is from 40 per cent of non-Canadian,
19 non-ethnic programming. I really hope that that is not
20 a fact.
21 1185 If it is not ethnic revenues that are
22 providing the funding for ethnic television stations,
23 then why keep them? Why not just allow television
24 stations to provide more air time to independent
25 producers and allow for programming that is fitting to
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1 one of the program Types A to E and let producers show
2 their freedom of expression and creativity to their
3 ethnic audience.
4 1186 With the increasingly multicultural
5 and multilingual nature of Canada's population, I
6 believe that specific policy is needed and this should
7 include policy for foreign distribution via satellite
8 that apply for services via cable. This service should
9 be allowed, I believe, but it should have the same
10 percentage as ethnic stations now have to comply with.
11 I believe that 60/40 would be reasonable. There is
12 need in our own community to have this particular,
13 including foreign satellite, viewed in people's home
14 through cable and through my program I have 11,000
15 signatures on a petition which I could provide to the
16 CRTC, which they would like to have cable access to
17 RTPI. However, they do want to keep their programming
18 and the only fair way of doing that is to be able to
19 have a percentage in the same manner that the ethnic
20 stations have and I do believe that 60/40 is right.
21 1187 This is the only way of protecting
22 the community clubs, organizations that my program
23 services. This is the only way that the ethnic groups
24 can continue to reflect Canada's national, regional and
25 local experience through their television programming.
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1 Allowing 100 per cent of any foreign service to be
2 aired on cable is establishing cultural media ghettos
3 within Canada.
4 1188 The Canadian Broadcasting Act states,
5 and I am sure you know of it, that the Canadian
6 broadcasting system should serve the needs and
7 interests and reflect the circumstances and aspirations
8 of Canadian men, women and children, including equal
9 rights, the logistic duality and multicultural and
10 multiracial nature of Canadian society.
11 1189 In phrasing so, I would like to know
12 if ethnic television stations and program producers
13 were able to access at least 10 per cent of the public
14 revenues that CBC receives we would all be a lot
15 happier as ethnic program producers.
16 1190 If the CBC would have to follow the
17 same policy that ethnic program stations and producers
18 follow I am sure that the CBC would not be quite happy
19 with what they would be asked to do, but they would be
20 providing a Canadian national network by at least
21 reflecting exactly what Canadian culture is all about,
22 diversity. I believe that our own Canadian national
23 network should be the first one to do so and perhaps
24 provide and be asked to provide a lot more of the Type
25 E programming that the CRTC specifies.
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1 1191 Yes, mainstream radio and television
2 stations should be encouraged to broadcast Type E
3 programming, but let's start first of all with that
4 particular one, the CBC. If CBC's programming can
5 reflect the true nature and the true diversity of
6 Canada, then perhaps we would all be a lot more
7 educated and a lot more ethically cultural and more
8 ethnic Canadians.
9 1192 I believe that I am at the end of it.
10 I would just like to let you know that I want to thank,
11 first of all, CHIN RADIO. Mr. Lombardi is here,
12 junior, and CityTV. I will be providing a written
13 brief which will go in depth into the questions in the
14 review policy, as well as some letters from viewers and
15 sponsors of the program.
16 1193 Thank you.
17 1194 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
18 much, Ms Pedro. I want to ask you one quick question
19 of clarification before we take a short break.
20 1195 If I understood you correctly, you
21 said that you are in favour of foreign services being
22 licensed into the Canadian market, but you think they
23 should be subject to the same 60/40 requirement?
24 1196 MS PEDRO: Yes.
25 1197 THE CHAIRPERSON: Considering that we
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1 don't really have jurisdiction, not that we don't
2 really, we don't have jurisdiction --
3 1198 MS PEDRO: You should.
4 1199 THE CHAIRPERSON: I was trying to be
5 soft about it. We don't have jurisdiction over foreign
6 services. How would you suggest that we enforce the
7 60/40 split?
8 1200 MS PEDRO: Do you have jurisdiction
9 over what is broadcast in Canada?
10 1201 THE CHAIRPERSON: If we authorize a
11 service for distribution on a distribution undertaking
12 that's one thing, but we can't control their content.
13 1202 MS PEDRO: I am not asking you to
14 control their content. I am asking that within the 24
15 hours or within the one week that 60 per cent of that
16 be the foreign service and that 40 per cent of it be
17 production, Canadian production in the ethnic
18 programming language.
19 1203 THE CHAIRPERSON: I see. You are
20 suggesting someone apply for --
21 1204 MS PEDRO: Absolutely.
22 1205 THE CHAIRPERSON: -- a channel.
23 1206 MS PEDRO: Absolutely.
24 1207 THE CHAIRPERSON: Which would
25 incorporate 60 per cent of the programming which
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1 appears on the foreign service and 40 per cent would be
2 Canadian?
3 1208 MS PEDRO: Absolutely.
4 1209 THE CHAIRPERSON: That's an
5 interesting suggestion. I am glad I asked.
6 1210 Thank you.
7 1211 MS PEDRO: You are welcome.
8 1212 THE CHAIRPERSON: We are going to
9 take a 15-minute break. We will be back at twenty-five
10 minutes after nine.
11 --- Short recess at 2105 / Courte suspension à 2105
12 --- Upon resuming at 2125 / Reprise à 2125
13 1213 THE CHAIRPERSON: Ladies and
14 gentlemen, I would ask you to take your seats and we
15 will get a move on or shake a leg, as the saying goes.
16 1214 We are on the home stretch. I
17 believe we have 11 or 12 parties yet to make their
18 presentations. So once again I would encourage you
19 kindly to keep your remarks to 10 minutes, so that we
20 can get through them by a reasonable hour.
21 1215 Madam Secretary.
22 1216 MS RHÉAUME: Our next speaker is Mr.
23 Bob Cousins.
24 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
25 1217 MR. COUSINS: Thank you, ladies and
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1 gentlemen from the CRTC.
2 1218 I will try to be as brief as I can,
3 although after doing this for nearly two decades it
4 really needs a whole lot more time, but I will take
5 advantage of the opportunity to make a written
6 submission, along with some of the comments I will make
7 right here.
8 1219 There is a rather bulky performer in
9 Nashville. His name is Johnny Russell, who is quite
10 funny too, is a great songwriter and he says "Can
11 everybody see me all right?" I think you can and I
12 believe you can hear me all right.
13 1220 I am very grateful for this
14 opportunity to speak directly to each of you this
15 evening on ethnic programming and to offer some
16 constructive suggestions on how to improve the delivery
17 of this essential service. Under the present
18 legislation there is room for abuse and unfairness can
19 be practised. The owner of a multicultural licence can
20 take any unilateral action he wishes and the
21 producer/host has little or no protection in the Act or
22 the legislation.
23 1221 Often you have an air tenure at the
24 whim of the broadcaster or the holder of the licence.
25 The rights of the producer should be enshrined in new
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1 legislation. Each producer should become a member of
2 the board of directors. Radio and television station
3 policies would more reflect the wishes and the needs of
4 the producers and the communities that they serve.
5 1222 In most cases the producers sell the
6 time that they have acquired from the licence holder to
7 advertisers in a community at large. There are many
8 obstacles to the successful pursuit of the advertising
9 dollar in this very competitive marketplace. I am
10 going to list five.
11 1223 The station has a sales force of its
12 own in competition with the producers. Unfair.
13 1224 B - stations limit the marketplace.
14 National advertisers, for instance, belong to the
15 station.
16 1225 C - multicultural radio does not
17 subscribe to the BBM I understand, or the three
18 stations that I have been at, which means that tool is
19 not available to the producer to help him make a sale.
20 1226 D, or No. 4, most advertisers who can
21 fit the format and afford the producer the revenue to
22 pay the costs are represented by often hostile
23 advertising agencies. Agencies who, if you succeed in
24 getting to them, insist on loads of demographic
25 material that only the big commercial radio station has
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1 the resources to provide -- a very serious handicap.
2 Try getting Labatt's or Molson's or somebody like that
3 on side for your radio program. You've got to have
4 more clout than this Newfie boy.
5 1227 No. 5. Often business firms will buy
6 advertising only from the ethnic radio show of their
7 own cultural community or heritage. There is nothing
8 fair or just about the above. The station should not
9 have a sales force that competes against the producer.
10 Both parties should be seen to be pursuing the same
11 goals. As it now stands, the producer is always the
12 loser.
13 1228 A fellow told me one time, if you
14 want to give advice to a soldier, walk in a soldier's
15 shoes. Well, for nearly 20 years in multicultural
16 radio in Ontario I have been there. Even though I got
17 a shower there's still some blood on me.
18 1229 The station should not limit the
19 scope of the producer's sales reach, as is stated in B
20 above.
21 1230 Looking at item C and D, it is clear
22 that the multiculture station should subscribe to the
23 BBM and give the producer all the tools he needs to
24 reach his potential advertising customer.
25 1231 Not all groups are strong enough to
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1 support their own radio and television programs
2 financially and there are many reasons for this. In my
3 case, much of my audience is drawn from the Atlantic
4 basin. They are employees, not employers. They have
5 lived in the Atlantic region for generations; Irish,
6 English, Welsh, French and Scottish in the main.
7 1232 Unlike the newer Canadians, most of
8 the Atlantic ex-patriots merely down the road to get a
9 job in their own country, while the newer Canadian came
10 into the country to make a new home, a new life and he
11 determined that he should create a job, a business and
12 be a captain of industry, trade or commerce, not an
13 employee subject to the ups and downs of the economy
14 and the whim of an employer. Often these newer
15 Canadians have certain financial advantages from
16 government programs and funding such as multicultural
17 funding.
18 1233 So the Atlantic programmer, the
19 producer or the host, does not have the business base
20 to draw on for revenues. A fair-minded subsidy must be
21 arrived at to make up for this inequality.
22 1234 There should be some options here to
23 overcome this handicap. Consider several cable
24 television channels that could pool their revenue and
25 share the 24-hour day among major groups, such as the
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1 Portuguese and the black community, the Chinese. I
2 think the Italians are well looked after. Cable
3 television channels that could pool their revenue and
4 share the 24-hour day would be something for the CRTC
5 to give serious consideration to.
6 1235 The Canadian Broadcasting Corporation
7 should make some of its radio time available for shows
8 such as mine. A block of time at CBC television and
9 Newsworld should be directed to accept shows such as
10 mine. So far the doors are shut tight.
11 1236 By the way, I don't want to sound
12 like I'm a whiner. I'm a pretty positive guy. I would
13 tell you a few jokes if we had time, but we don't have
14 time. I know you want to recognize a Newfie in heaven
15 when you get there. That's the fellow who keeps on
16 saying, "Boys, when are we going home?" You are
17 allowed to laugh here, you know.
18 1237 But anyway, there are some problems
19 with this and we can fix it if we are men and women of
20 goodwill.
21 1238 The ethnic broadcasting should not be
22 limited to the new or the third language. Think how
23 unfair that is. Don't you think the Irish still yearn
24 for the songs of home? For your information by the
25 way, per capita there are more Irish in New Brunswick
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1 than any other province. In Newfoundland there is
2 about 40 per cent. The songs of home, mother Ireland.
3 1239 And don't these ex-patriots of Nova
4 Scotia, living in Mississauga or Brampton, don't they
5 hear the songs of the bagpipes? They don't hear them
6 on CHUM. They don't hear them on CFRB. They don't
7 hear them on 1430-CHKT. When I was on there I used to
8 say that stood for "coaster hearts keep ticking".
9 1240 Don't you think they want to hear the
10 songs of their childhood? How many of you heard the
11 song "A Mother's Love is a Blessing"? That's what our
12 cultural makeup is all about. "Kelly's Mountain" by
13 Harold MacIntyre, "The Ghost of Bras d'or," "The Song
14 for the Myra". We get to hear that once in a while
15 because a child of the CBC, Anne Murray, became a great
16 American star and we get to hear Annie sing "The Song
17 for the Myra".
18 1241 What about the fiddle tunes of Don
19 Messer and the Islanders? Some of you know what
20 happened to that show, don't you. Some very, very
21 clever fellows at the CBC in Toronto years ago decided
22 to axe the most popular television show of all time.
23 That same mentality existed a couple of years ago when
24 country music, which was born in the USA of the songs
25 of the Irish and the Scottish and the English and the
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1 Cajuns that we sent away from the Atlantic region back
2 in the Seven Years' War to the southern USA, the CBC
3 saw fit to dump the Tommy Hunter Show. That's country
4 music -- music of the people. Then recently they got
5 another virus and they got rid of the Rita McNeil Show.
6 1242 Think about John Alan Cameron of Cape
7 Breton and Harry Hibbs of Newfoundland. Both of them
8 can be considered the two that led to the rise of
9 interest in all things Celtic in Toronto. It took more
10 than 30 years for the songs in the bars and the clubs
11 of Toronto to convince the boys back home that Toronto
12 and Canada would be receptive if they polished up the
13 music of their forefathers. And now you hear the
14 Rankins a fair bit, the Barragh MacNeil's, Natalie
15 McMaster, Ashley McIsaac. That's just the tip of the
16 iceberg. The vast majority of those you could have
17 heard them on CIAO radio one time when I had a voice
18 there.
19 1243 You could have heard them one time
20 late Sunday night on 1250-CHWO when I had a voice
21 there, and you could have heard them, four straight
22 hours, the Breakfast Club on 1430-CHKT, which stands
23 for "coaster hearts keep ticking," with Bob the
24 Codfish, yours truly, but that voice is silent.
25 1244 Yes, sir, the sad truth is that only
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1 a fraction of that good stuff has seen the light of
2 day. The advantage seems to be given to the new
3 Canadian. See the title of this review -- it says
4 right here, "CRTC to review its policy on third
5 language". As the song says, "when will they ever
6 learn up in Ottawa".
7 1245 I hope I am moving along as quickly
8 as i can.
9 1246 THE CHAIRPERSON: Maybe one more
10 minute.
11 1247 MR. COUSINS: By golly, have I used
12 up nine?
13 1248 THE CHAIRPERSON: It goes really
14 fast.
15 1249 MR. COUSINS: This is a letter from
16 Jean Gilbert. She's at the Memorial Hospital in
17 Brampton. She wrote this when she learned that I
18 couldn't promote their lobster festival. It's a
19 charity group, the Lions Club and so on. She says,
20 "It's sad to think that immigrants are given more
21 consideration than the population who has been born and
22 bred in Canada, spend their whole lives making Canada,
23 Ontario and Brampton a better place to live in and also
24 a place where many of these immigrants come to reside
25 and reap the benefits of what Canadians have worked so
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1 hard to achieve over many years." She is saying that
2 there is no fair play.
3 1250 Back to funding again. Consider a
4 new lottery whose proceeds could go to fund
5 multiculture radio. I prefer the term "public radio"
6 as I think the other word, "multiculture" covers the
7 services for newer Canadians only. It's also divisive
8 and counterproductive.
9 1251 Don't leave it to the private
10 broadcaster as he is not interested in the music of the
11 people, folk music. You have the broadcaster fighting
12 you now over the 35 per cent Cancon, and now since
13 especially many radio stations are calling themselves
14 new country, little or nothing gets played that would
15 be considered traditional country or folk or Cajun or
16 Celtic or coaster music. Where is Stompin' Tom and Ned
17 Landry, Gene MacLellan of PEI. Does anybody here --
18 can you name one of the two songs that that man wrote?
19 A great songwriter from PEI. He wrote "Put Your Hand
20 in the Hand of the Man". He wrote "Snowbird" for Annie
21 Murray and much more, but we don't hear him on private
22 radio. We don't hear him on multicultural radio.
23 1252 No. Too ethnic they tell you. Will
24 they play the songs of Roy Payne, the most prolific
25 songwriter of Newfoundland? No. Wrote a great song,
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1 "The Little Boats of Newfoundland". Newfoundlanders
2 cry, and others too, when they listen to the words of
3 that song. Too ethnic they tell you.
4 1253 I am going to do a couple more notes
5 here until you cut me off. Radio should offer songs,
6 not only in your personal collection and, more
7 importantly, it passes on the history and the tradition
8 of music and in our case that of the coast. Without
9 hearing those so-called classics on the radio, our
10 youth will never know what came before.
11 1254 We all lose by not having access to
12 the vast treasury of our music greats. How can we have
13 a culture as vibrant and as rich as the U.S. if the
14 Canadian broadcaster continues to feel he has no place
15 in the scheme of developing a star system?
16 1255 As it stands, neither the private nor
17 public broadcaster is doing the job that the
18 Broadcasting Act calls for. Carefully consider some
19 priorities; encourage the new Canadians to do
20 productions of music in Canada. Now much of the
21 revenue from the sums paid to SOCAN are going out of
22 the country to foreign writers and producers, and in
23 the case of my former radio station, 1430-CHKT, I would
24 assume that more than 70 per cent appears to be foreign
25 content. My show was 99 per cent Canadian Cancon.
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1 1256 Factor does not work for the producer
2 of public radio shows. Open up Factor and give it the
3 funds to assist producers such as us.
4 1257 Producers need bridge financing at
5 low interest rates. Small sums of money will keep
6 small but essential producers on the air. Politicians
7 must pay more than lip service. At least assist
8 producers who seek their help and that goes for the
9 CRTC too. There have been walls of silence or nearly
10 that. I have experienced that int he past seven
11 months. I have no time to make strong comments or
12 quotes here, but I can.
13 1258 Now, the needs of my audience are
14 being neglected. No news from the coast, no music, no
15 information on events, nothing on the Music Awards show
16 in its eleventh year, the four Atlantic provinces have
17 a great awards show and they are meeting in St. John's
18 on February 11 to the 14. Nobody in my community knows
19 about that.
20 1259 I will just take one more moment, if
21 I may. This year on March 31 will mark the fiftieth
22 anniversary of Newfoundland's entry into Confederation.
23 Now, there was a time when some Canadians felt that
24 Canada should be united from ocean unto ocean and the
25 dream and the vision of John A. Macdonald was realized
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1 in 1949. My province -- my native province, I stand
2 for all four and Ontario as well and Canada, and I am a
3 citizen of the world in its broadest respect. I grew
4 up with Americans on an Air Force base in Newfoundland.
5 The world was at my doorstep and I have no malice
6 toward any man or woman here or elsewhere.
7 1260 But let me just say this, that you
8 people are unaware that we are calling this in
9 Newfoundland this year "Soirée '99," but if this voice
10 were allowed to be on a multicultural radio station in
11 Greater Toronto Area, you would hear about it.
12 1261 Silent too is the government in
13 Ottawa. You don't read it in the mainstream
14 newspapers, Newfoundland celebrating the fact that it's
15 50 years as the tenth province, and what has been going
16 on in multicultural radio has been going on for the
17 past 50 years with the east coast of Canada, raped,
18 pillaged, exploited, huge factory ships vacuum up the
19 renewable resource, the cod and the rest of it in the
20 Atlantic region.
21 1262 THE CHAIRPERSON: Mr. Cousins, I am
22 really sorry to interrupt you, but you have had about
23 20 minutes now.
24 1263 MR. COUSINS: I would like 30 seconds
25 more, if I may, and I thank you.
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1 1264 THE CHAIRPERSON: I would like to
2 thank you for your views and I would encourage you to
3 put any other comments that you would like to make on
4 the public record in writing.
5 1265 MR. COUSINS: One final comment, if I
6 may, Madam Chairman.
7 1266 I have a brochure from Nashville.
8 They have a Grand Ole Opry, they call it, on WSM radio,
9 celebrating about 75 years in existence right now.
10 That radio station and that institution led to country
11 music becoming the biggest format music in the world.
12 All of us here tonight understand how valuable radio
13 and a radio show is. I stand to work with anybody and
14 everybody and it is most regrettable that you will not
15 hear "the codfish" on Saturday morning. That voice has
16 been silenced. Perhaps you could help us get a voice
17 back again.
18 1267 I just want to also say that I saw in
19 the paper that the gates are being opened to help the
20 black community get a radio licence. I endorse and
21 support that.
22 1268 Thank you so much. Even though I am
23 not on the air, I still feel I am a part of the
24 community that I sit among and I have the greatest,
25 most profound respect for you. Let's fix it because
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1 Canada will be in trouble otherwise.
2 1269 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
3 much, Mr. Cousins.
4 1270 MR. COUSINS: Thank you.
5 1271 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.
6 1272 MS RHÉAUME: The next speaker is Mr.
7 Calvin Wong, Regional Director for Fairchild Media.
8 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
9 1273 MR. WONG: Good evening,
10 Commissioners, and members of the public. I am Calvin
11 Wong, Regional Director of Fairchild Media Group.
12 1274 Fairchild welcomes the opportunity to
13 participate in the Commission's review of third
14 language and ethnic broadcasting policy. We appreciate
15 in particular the Commission's efforts to reach out to
16 individuals within many multicultural communities in
17 Canada and to gain an appreciation of the role ethnic
18 broadcasting plays in the lives of Canadians.
19 1275 We believe the current policy has
20 been critical in the development of distinctive ethnic
21 service and remains a key factor to our success.
22 1276 The Fairchild Media Group has a
23 significant commitment to the Canadian ethnic
24 broadcasting, with interests in four radio stations, as
25 well as our specialty television service, Fairchild
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1 Television and Talentvision.
2 1277 Fairchild first entered ethnic radio
3 broadcasting in 1992, when we were issued a licence for
4 CJVB-AM Vancouver. Since then, Fairchild has expanded
5 through the acquisition of the AM-1430, which our
6 friend Bob Cousins just referred to, in Toronto and new
7 FM undertakings in Calgary and Vancouver, which we
8 operate in partnership with the OK Radio Group.
9 1278 In addition, we produce a total of 29
10 hours of Chinese programs per week on CIRV-FM in
11 Toronto. Recently, we received authority to utilize
12 the SCMO of our Vancouver FM to provide a
13 Korean-language service.
14 1279 In keeping with the current policy
15 framework, these stations each face the challenge of
16 serving a wide range of cultural groups in a
17 significant number of different languages. For
18 example, 14 cultural groups in a minimum of 15
19 different languages are served by our Toronto AM
20 station. We are proud of the tremendous variety of
21 programming these stations provide to a broad
22 cross-section of communities, including Cambodians,
23 Jamaicans, Greeks, Malay, Laotian, Persian, Indians,
24 Vietnamese and Korean.
25 1280 To further advance multiethnic
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1 broadcasting, Fairchild Radio recently established a
2 scholarship at Ryerson University School of
3 Broadcasting, aimed at promoting cross-cultural
4 understanding and expanding the presence of Canadians
5 from different ethnic backgrounds in the media.
6 1281 At the television side, in 1993 we
7 acquired the assets of Chinavision, a national Chinese
8 language specialty undertaking. Today Fairchild
9 Television continues to serve the Canadian Chinese
10 community, broadcasting primarily in Cantonese. About
11 300,000 subscribers currently receive the service via
12 cable, direct-to-home satellite, or in the more limited
13 areas by MDS.
14 1282 In addition to Fairchild Television,
15 we also operate Talentvision, a regional specialty
16 undertaking acquired in 1993 which serves over 14,000
17 British Columbia subscribers.
18 1283 Talentvision focuses on the fast
19 growing Mandarin speaking population and also carries
20 programs in Korean and Vietnamese.
21 1284 Fairchild Television and Talentvision
22 provide a mix of Canadian and foreign programming, with
23 news and information produced in our Toronto and
24 Vancouver studios.
25 1285 We also produce and show the Chinese
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1 dubbed version of English TV programs, such as CTV's
2 W5, CBC's Venture and TVO's Inquiring Minds during our
3 prime time. We are also pleased to report that
4 increasingly these Canadian productions are in demand
5 as exports to other countries. For example, Time Line
6 magazine, a weekly public affairs magazine prime story,
7 a documentary series profiling Chinese Canadians and
8 our language/teaching programs are shown in Hong Kong
9 now and will be soon seen in southern China.
10 1286 Both through our programming and as a
11 corporate citizen Fairchild has made a concerted effort
12 to be connected to the communities we serve and, in
13 turn, to connect our viewers to each other and to other
14 Canadians. To illustrate the above statement, I would
15 like to draw your attention to the busy schedule of our
16 staff in the next two weeks.
17 1287 First, we will be hosting a total of
18 12 community events around town to celebrate the
19 Chinese New Year.
20 1288 Secondly, we are conducting the
21 winter clothing drive for the Salvation Army. With our
22 last record was a total of 88 tons of clothing
23 collected in a month's time, and at the same time our
24 news department is mapping out a strategy for the
25 coverage of the federal budget and the forthcoming
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1 Ontario election.
2 1289 Our experience in both radio and
3 television has confirmed the important role ethnic
4 service can play in the Canadian broadcasting system by
5 strengthening the multicultural fabric of our
6 community. We firmly believe there continues to be a
7 need for distinct ethnic policy and that the
8 fine-tuning may as part of this review should build on
9 the strong framework already in place.
10 1290 We appreciate that public
11 consultation is not a forum for a detailed analysis.
12 We will, therefore, highlight on only a few key points.
13 1291 On the radio side, Fairchild believes
14 the current Canadian and ethnic content level remains
15 appropriate. However, licensees must be provided with
16 greater flexibility in the scheduling of programming.
17 This flexibility will allow market demand to regulate
18 program schedules, while the existing safeguards
19 continue to ensure the quantity and the diversity of
20 ethnic programming.
21 1292 We appreciate the need for the
22 diversity of ethnic programming, but asking a more
23 popular language group to subsidize other language
24 groups is not helpful to the development of ethnic
25 radio.
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1 1293 We are very happy to play our part in
2 the family of Canadian broadcasters, but the burden of
3 supporting service to very small groups should not
4 solely rest on the shoulders of ethnic broadcasters.
5 1294 In television, Fairchild has a number
6 of recommendations. First, we believe ethnic service
7 should be afforded the same access to distribution as
8 the Canadian specialty service -- in other words, upon
9 the earlier of September 1, 1999 or the introduction of
10 digital cable. Fairchild Television continues to
11 struggle to obtain cable distribution.
12 1295 In October 1997, thanks to the quick
13 and decisive intervention of the Commission, many
14 Fairchild subscribers in Toronto and Vancouver were
15 spared from losing the service.
16 1296 While we are available in Toronto,
17 Vancouver, Edmonton, Calgary and Victoria, the service
18 is not carried in Montreal, Winnipeg, Ottawa, the
19 Atlantic provinces or in many of the growing
20 communities around Toronto, such as Oakville,
21 Newmarket, Whitby, Ajax.
22 1297 Secondly, Fairchild supports the
23 existing policy which refuses to add a foreign service
24 to the eligible list, which would be competitive with a
25 Canadian specialty licence. This continued protection
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1 is vital to the growth of distinctive ethnic
2 programming.
3 1298 Finally, Fairchild does not believe
4 the licensing of a national ethnic network is
5 consistent with the evolving lists of the Canadian
6 ethnic communities, particularly in a digital
7 environment. Like all Canadians, ethnic viewers want
8 to assess a variety of programming in the language of
9 their choice, at times to suit their daily schedule. A
10 national multiethnic network would not only fail to
11 meet these needs, but would threaten the viability of
12 the specialty services that do.
13 1299 However, should the Commission see
14 fit to licence such a network, we believe its condition
15 of licence must be structured to protect existing third
16 language specialty services.
17 1300 In closing, I would like to say
18 something from my own personal experience. I studied
19 mass communications in university before I came to
20 Canada. I worked for 18 years in radio and television
21 broadcasting in Hong Kong. Right now I am very pleased
22 to say that because of the current policy framework I
23 am able to employ every bit of my experience and
24 knowledge in my work with Fairchild to contribute to
25 the development of the Canadian media industry.
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1 1301 I have been to places in the U.S.,
2 Australia and Europe where large ethnic Chinese
3 populations do exist. I am proud to report that Canada
4 produces the highest quality and the largest quantity
5 of Chinese television and radio programs outside of
6 Asia. I hope through this policy review we can work to
7 further improve our system, that such a rewarding
8 experience can be offered to those who are now working
9 and those who will be joining the growing family of
10 Canadian ethnic broadcasters.
11 1302 I look forward to listening to the
12 remaining submissions and would be pleased to answer
13 any questions that you may have.
14 1303 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
15 much, Mr. Wong.
16 1304 I don't think we have any questions,
17 but that's an interesting piece of information that you
18 shared with us about the amount of Chinese programming
19 that is being done in Canada.
20 1305 Thank you for bringing that to our
21 attention.
22 1306 MR. WONG: Thank you.
23 1307 MS RHÉAUME: The next speaker is
24 Hanny Hassan.
25 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
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1 1308 MR. HASSAN: Thank you.
2 1309 Good evening, Commissioners. Just a
3 word about my affiliations. I am the President of the
4 Council of the Muslim Community of Canada, a member
5 organization of the Canadian Ethnocultural Council, an
6 umbrella organization of some communities across
7 Canada. I am the Past President of the Ontario
8 Advisory Council on Multiculturalism and Citizenship,
9 in which capacity I was responsible for providing
10 policy advice to the Government of Ontario on matters
11 of multiculturalism and citizenship. And, finally, I
12 should tell you that I am on the Community Advisory
13 Committee of CFMT-TV.
14 1310 I applaud your endurance and
15 attention to everyone tonight and since I have provided
16 written copies of my text I will skip some of the text
17 in the interests of trying to move things along.
18 1311 Many of the speakers tonight have
19 spoken about the multicultural characteristic of
20 Canada, both in its legislative and constitutional
21 ways. I won't go into the details. However, it is our
22 position that all agencies and institutions of
23 government based on the constitutional legislation are
24 obligated to formulate policies and implement systems
25 that are consistent with the multicultural character of
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1 Canada.
2 1312 Specifically, the broadcast system
3 has under its particular legislation been directed to
4 address the diverse needs of Canada's population. I
5 might just add here that I take some exception to the
6 comments of Mr. Cousins. I digress here. While he may
7 have some particular grievances with which I am quite
8 sympathetic relating to others outside of the
9 ethno-cultural communities, it is in fact a policy of
10 Canada for some time to recognize the distinctiveness
11 of this society and the diversity. In my capacity as
12 the President of the Ontario Advisory Council, in fact
13 our inclusive definition of multiculturalism in fact
14 included English and French-speaking people, people of
15 those origins and the native community. We speak
16 tonight of diversity and not simply of the ethnic
17 composition of Canada.
18 1313 In terms of the demographic changes
19 that have occurred in Canada over the last 35 years or
20 so, it has not only increased the number of people
21 within the ethnocultural population, but also its
22 diversity. Long-term demographic needs, including
23 Canada's relatively low birthrate and aging population,
24 indicate that Canada will require immigrants for
25 workforce development and for the support of our social
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1 service programs. Similar demographic trends exist in
2 Asia -- in Europe. Consequently, new immigrants will
3 continue to come from a variety of countries,
4 representing diverse linguistic, racial, ethnic and
5 religious communities.
6 1314 Consequently, in addition to the
7 legislative responsibility, there is a need for
8 broadcast systems to be representative of the diverse
9 population and that need will increase in the future.
10 1315 The CRTC has recognized this in its
11 1985 Public Notice and it wrote in that document
12 extensively on its position on multiculturalism.
13 Parenthetically, one wonders why the announcement on
14 this policy review, however, has been entitled "Third
15 Language and Ethnic Programming" rather than
16 "Programming for Canada's Linguistic and Cultural
17 Diversity" as the policy has been called.
18 1316 In my view, the new nomenclature
19 marginalizes those whose first language is not either
20 French or English and who come from other ethnocultural
21 communities.
22 1317 The Commission intends to examine the
23 relevance of its ethnic broadcasting policy in the
24 light of increasing availability of ethnocultural
25 services from sources other than ethnic stations. It
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1 seems to me that it is self-evident that the CRTC is
2 obligated to continue to develop its policies with
3 respect to linguistic and cultural diversity. In
4 answer to questions in section 29(2) of the Public
5 Notice, the answer is a resounding no. The needs
6 cannot be met without a policy. Even if the needs
7 could be met, the CRTC has a responsibility to
8 formulate a policy.
9 1318 The availability of alternative or
10 additional services does not diminish either the
11 responsibility or the need for a policy, just as the
12 maturation of French-language programs would not
13 diminish or distinguish the need for a policy in that
14 regard. In fact, in the clause of the Broadcasting Act
15 referring to cultural diversity, the multicultural and
16 multiracial responsibilities are contained and have the
17 same footing as the need to reflect the linguistic
18 duality of Canada.
19 1319 Our objective should not be to
20 determine the need for such a policy, but to develop
21 this content and the mechanisms that will be used to
22 implement the policy.
23 1320 It is imperative that a distinct
24 framework be responsive to Canada's linguistic and
25 cultural communities. The absence of a policy and
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1 regulations would relegate the multilingual and
2 multicultural communities to the margins of the
3 broadcast system.
4 1321 Market forces cannot be expected to
5 be responsive to these needs. The sparseness of the
6 multicultural population across the country and the
7 emergence of new ethnocultural communities mitigate
8 against equitable and accessible broadcasting services.
9 Even though a significant portion of the population are
10 located in major cities, the need is even more acute in
11 the small and remote communities where there is neither
12 the concentration or the resources to address market
13 concerns.
14 1322 While these gaps can perhaps be
15 filled by other services, this would inequitably
16 exclude this programming from the mainstream broadcast
17 services and there are costs that the audience would
18 incur associated with most of those alternatives.
19 Those are both barriers to access.
20 1323 It seems to me that there are two
21 possible approaches to this concern. One approach is
22 to mandate that all broadcast services carry a minimum
23 amount of multilingual and multicultural programming.
24 Alternatively, a network of stations, whose reach would
25 include towns, villages and rural Canada, could be
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1 developed to provide multilingual and multicultural
2 programming across Canada. The first approach would
3 result in broad, but relatively superficial coverage
4 and would not be supportive of the development of
5 superior and professional capabilities. It would have
6 the advantage of representation within the mainstream
7 system, of the diversity of the Canadian population.
8 1324 The alternative of a network would
9 provide the depth to provide exceptional programs,
10 sharing of resources, intercultural co-operation and so
11 forth. Its disadvantage is that it may not be watched
12 by others.
13 1325 In a previous Public Notice this
14 year, Additional National Television networks - a
15 Report to the Government of Canada, the CRTC deferred
16 consideration of a national multilingual television
17 network pending the results of this particular policy
18 review.
19 1326 We believe that the needs of the
20 multilingual and multicultural communities can best be
21 met with the establishment of a national television
22 network, responsive to this audience.
23 1327 The CRTC has requested comments on
24 several programming areas. We believe that priority
25 should be given to the Canadian experience --
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1 programming areas b), c), d) and e. Those are the
2 programming areas identified in section 29 of the
3 Public notice as distinct from the category Types A to
4 E are the ones that we are referring to that should
5 have priority. Programming area e), while important,
6 should not have the same priority.
7 1328 We believe that another priority
8 programming area, not included, should be the fostering
9 of a Canadian variant of the native cultures. Culture
10 is not static. Both in Canada and in the homeland,
11 culture continues to evolve, frequently in different
12 directions. The experience of the people of Quebec and
13 of the Acadians are examples of communities that have
14 developed differently from their origins and from each
15 other. The broadcasting system should provide access
16 to this type of expression.
17 1329 Programming area c) should also
18 promote -- which would promote cross-cultural
19 understanding. This is important since many immigrants
20 and refugees come to Canada from areas of conflict.
21 Additionally, the programming should foster
22 inter-cultural co-operation. Many groups share common
23 values and traditions. By working together small
24 communities may, collectively, have the resources and
25 the audience to meet their combined needs.
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1 1330 With respect to the program types in
2 the current policy, we believe that a modest credit
3 should be given to multilingual/multicultural stations
4 to encourage their production of this type of
5 programming -- in terms of Type E programming I mean
6 here. The credit should be structured so that it does
7 not significantly impact the station's commitments with
8 respect to Types A to D.
9 1331 In addition, we believe that all
10 other radio and television stations have a
11 responsibility to provide programming in one of the
12 official languages depicting Canada's cultural, racial
13 and religious diversity through services that are
14 multicultural, educational, informational,
15 cross-cultural and inter-cultural in nature. We
16 believe that these stations should also be required to
17 carry some Type E programming.
18 1332 In the existing CRTC policy it is
19 acknowledged the substantial representations made
20 regarding balance, fair portrayal and stereotyping. We
21 concur that it would be onerous to expect the CRTC to
22 closely monitor all on-air programming. However, the
23 reliance of the Commission on complaints from the
24 public is unacceptable, since it is reactive and there
25 is no way to redress the damage done by unacceptable
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1 programs. All of the remedies suggested by the CRTC in
2 the current policy respond to complaints and do not
3 seek to proactively address the problem.
4 1333 Previous submissions, as noted in the
5 1985 policy, recommended the establishment of a CRTC
6 Consultative Committee and a National Advisory
7 Committee. We are not aware, but do not believe that
8 these committees have been established and, if so, we
9 wonder about their effectiveness.
10 1334 As described in Public Notice CRTC
11 1985-139, the suggested mandate of the National
12 Advisory Committee is described and I will just skip
13 that since you have that on record.
14 1335 In addition to the objectives that
15 are listed, we believe that there is also an
16 opportunity for both broadcasters and the multicultural
17 community to educate each other through working
18 together on these committees. We consequently support
19 the creation of a National Advisory Committee.
20 1336 The Public notice alludes to the
21 subsidization of multilingual programming by mainstream
22 programming. We do not understand why this would be
23 surprising. Canada has evolved a complex system of
24 subsidies to support all manner of programs. Canada's
25 equalization payments, for example, allow the federal
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1 government to ensure an equitable distribution of
2 resources across the provinces. Our social services
3 sector is also an example of how these resources have
4 subsidized those who use the resources of those who
5 have by subsidizing those who do not.
6 1337 In fact, it is doubtful that many of
7 our mainstream cultural industries could prosper
8 without external support. If market forces were
9 allowed to determine the direction of our cultural
10 development in the increasingly global world we would
11 all become American.
12 1338 The current debate about split-run
13 magazines and cultural protection in trade matters
14 illustrates Canada's commitment to cultural sovereignty
15 and the need to take measures to ensure the continuing
16 growth of our cultural industry. This includes
17 multilingual and multicultural components of our
18 society.
19 1339 The CRTC should ensure that
20 appropriate mechanisms are available to ensure that
21 financial resources are available to foster the
22 development of programming reflective of Canada's
23 reality. This cannot be left to market forces.
24 1340 Thank you.
25 1341 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
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1 much, Mr. Hassan.
2 1342 MS RHÉAUME: The next presentation
3 will be by Ms Claudia Lopez.
4 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
5 1343 MS LOPEZ: Good evening everyone. My
6 name is Claudia Lopez. I am here to support the
7 assistance, permanence and promotion of third language
8 and ethnic programming and, more specifically, of
9 Telelatino Network.
10 1344 I am a psychotherapist at the Barbra
11 Schlifer Clinic, which is a non-profit government
12 organization that provides free legal counselling and
13 cultural interpretation services to female survivors of
14 child sexual abuse, incest, sexual assault and spousal
15 or partner abuse.
16 1345 On many occasions and for at least
17 three years I have been invited to Telelatino to
18 educate, inform, provide resources and support to the
19 Latin American community across Canada on issue of
20 sexual abuse, incest, partner abuse and violence in
21 general. For the purpose of this consultation I would
22 like to highlight some of the important advantages that
23 I think are in having the Telelatino Network services
24 offered to the Spanish-speaking community.
25 1346 The first and, in my view, the most
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1 important advantage is that through its programs the
2 Telelatino Network actively participates and engages
3 int he prevention, education and elimination of child
4 sexual abuse, incest and physical abuse of women,
5 children, the elderly in the Latin community and in
6 Canadian society at large.
7 1347 The second advantage is that through
8 its programs Telelatino helps the Spanish-speaking
9 community to connect and become less isolated. In
10 other words, Telelatino contributes to the development
11 of community participation and integration.
12 1348 Another advantage is that many people
13 who are being abused in Canada are isolated because
14 Spanish is the first and only language of
15 communication. Their families, community and support
16 systems are outside Canada and in some cases they live
17 in very isolated geographical areas here in Canada.
18 These people, unfortunately, as not only being abused,
19 but have no access to the legal, financial,
20 psychological and community resources that the Canadian
21 government provides to help women, children and ethnic
22 groups like the Latin community to be free from abuse.
23 1349 Telelatino Network has been and is an
24 excellent agent of change because it has been
25 educating, informing, supporting and providing remedies
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1 to the Latin American community on issues of abuse.
2 1350 Another advantage I believe is that
3 the issues, responses and alternatives that are offered
4 in relation to the problems of abuse help these people
5 who see the programs to identify their own issues and
6 to apply similar strategies and solutions by analogy.
7 1351 The last advantage that I want to
8 highlight relates to the saving of financial, physical
9 and human resources to the taxpayers of Canada. Child
10 sexual abuse, incest, sexual assault and spousal abuse
11 are all social problems that require our urgent
12 attention.
13 1352 The statistics indicate that a price
14 to taxpayers of providing treatment, legal and recovery
15 alternatives to one child sexual abuse survivor is of
16 $200,000.
17 1353 As Telelatino deals with prevention
18 and elimination of abuse, it also helps our community
19 to deal with financial problems, like drug addiction,
20 alcoholism, prostitution and crime to name some of the
21 consequences of abuse, but also it is important because
22 it helps Canadian taxpayers to save a lot of money,
23 time and resources by dealing with issues that create
24 great social disruption as is the case of violence and
25 abuse.
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1 1354 Thank you very much, Madam Chairman,
2 for allowing me to support the Telelatino Network and
3 the promotion of third language and ethnic programming
4 on behalf of the Barbra Schlifer Clinic and the Latin
5 community.
6 1355 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
7 much, Ms Lopez.
8 1356 MS RHÉAUME: Our next speaker will be
9 Mr. Kiumars Rezvanifar of KVC Communications Group.
10 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
11 1357 MR. REZVANIFAR: Good evening.
12 1358 My name is Kiumars Rezvanifar. I
13 have been an independent producer for two weekly
14 television programs for the iranian community in
15 Ontario for the past seven years. i would like to give
16 you a very brief background about the community for
17 which I serve.
18 1359 The nearly 100,000 members of the
19 Iranian community in Ontario have arrived in Canada
20 shortly after the political turmoil and the Islamic
21 revolution of 1979, exactly 20 years ago. It was the
22 first major immigration in the Iranian's 2,500 years of
23 history. Unlike most immigration that is caused by
24 economical reasons, oppression and political changes
25 and its effect on the Iranian society sparked the
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1 Iranian immigration. Thus, the educated and
2 "well-to-do" class of people left Iran destined to go
3 to Europe and North America.
4 1360 Internationally, because of the
5 American melting pot policy and Canada's policy of
6 multiculturalism, many immigrants chose Canada over the
7 United States and even over European counties. The
8 United Nations selection of Canada as, "The Best
9 Country to Live In," has also increased Canada's
10 popularity among immigrants.
11 1361 As we know, one of the main reasons
12 for this selection by the UN has been the multicultural
13 acceptance of the Canadian society and the respect that
14 Canada offers to the immigrants' cultural heritage, a
15 treatment that you cannot find in any part of the
16 world. The multicultural aspect of Canada has been
17 growing rapidly, and with it brings challenges and
18 opportunities which requires special attention and
19 consideration.
20 1362 As the immigrants arrive and settle
21 in Canada, many face problems and conflicts within the
22 new society, and if ignored it could lead to serious
23 problems. To address and solve these problems, Canada
24 requires a strong means of communication. The most
25 important part of this communication is language. In
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1 many communities, the two official languages of English
2 and French have proven to be inappropriate due to the
3 fact most of these immigrants speak neither of the two
4 languages. This is a situation where a comfort
5 language is essential to reach into these communities,
6 a language that they are familiar with and in which
7 they trust.
8 1363 The Iranian community's population in
9 Ontario has grown from 30,000 in 1990 to around 100,000
10 at the present time. The fact is this number is
11 growing rapidly by the arrival of every immigrant each
12 day.
13 1364 The two television programs that I
14 produce provide our community and our viewers with
15 entertainment and educational segments about Iran's
16 history and culture. But our main objectives are to
17 inform them about the Canadian society, history,
18 geography, lifestyle, the political system and its
19 issues.
20 1365 Through Farsi television programming
21 we encourage our viewers to think of themselves as
22 Canadians and promote them to participate in society
23 and contribute to Canada.
24 1366 Along with segments in Farsi about
25 the Canadian political system, we have invited many
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1 Members of Parliament to our programs and who have
2 spoken about Canada and we have invited our viewers to
3 participate in the political system. I am pleased to
4 announce that at the present time we have two Iranian
5 candidates in the upcoming election.
6 1367 Not only does Farsi television
7 programming inform the viewers about the Canadian
8 election system, tax programs, history and education,
9 it also exposes them to many opportunities provided by
10 the Canadian government. These opportunities could
11 easily integrate them into the Canadian society and
12 help them to become an active part of it.
13 1368 Through our Farsi language television
14 programming we have achieved many of these objectives
15 that we could not achieve using the English language.
16 1369 Two years ago, by the invitation of
17 the Canadian Soccer Federation, the Iranian national
18 soccer team came to Canada for a friendly match in
19 Toronto. It was a day that will remain in our hearts
20 and minds for a long time. During a two-month campaign
21 on our television programs on CFMT and CHEX we promoted
22 the Canadian values in our community and within
23 ourselves in such a way that the respect and admiration
24 towards the Canadian soccer team even surprised the
25 Canadian soccer players and the authorities. Many of
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1 the Iranian spectators were waving both the Iranian and
2 Canadian flags. The positive impact and warm reception
3 that was felt by the Canadian soccer team reflect the
4 major role our television programs on CFMT played
5 before the match.
6 1370 Through this multicultural television
7 system of programming, each community gets to know each
8 other and understand and respect each other's customs
9 and way of life and culture. This is an extremely
10 important aspect in a multicultural society. Our Farsi
11 television programs are not limited to the Iranian
12 audience, but viewers from the Greek, Italian, Indian
13 Afghani and Arabic communities have also shown interest
14 in parts of our programming. We also have their
15 advertising in our programs as well.
16 1371 The global, political and economic
17 conflicts and changes have made Canada to be home to
18 many ethnic communities. These communities were not in
19 existence in Canada in the 1980s.
20 1372 The flood of refugees and immigrants
21 to Canada indicates that Canada is and will be an ideal
22 destination for immigration. The change in the
23 immigration laws and policies could only slow the
24 process and numbers, but could not stop the arrival of
25 new immigrants each day.
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1 1373 Canada has to be ready to help
2 newcomers adopt easily and quickly. Multicultural
3 television programming has proven to be one of the
4 effective and key instruments in this process. As the
5 multicultural aspect of Canada grows, Canada should
6 increase and expand the role and operation of its
7 multicultural television programming.
8 1374 Multicultural television programming
9 has come a long way from being a part of a community or
10 access channel to its present status of being an
11 independent program on major television stations such
12 as CFMT in Toronto.
13 1375 We need to look forward into the near
14 future and try to view multicultural television
15 programming at the network level, where it could reach
16 and be effective to everyone and everywhere across
17 Canada. In a multicultural society, obviously English
18 and French are not the only means of effective
19 communication.
20 1376 Thank you.
21 1377 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
22 much, Mr. Rezvanifar.
23 1378 MS RHÉAUME: Our next presenter is Ms
24 Zelda Young.
25 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
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1 1379 MS YOUNG: Thank you very much.
2 Thank you for the opportunity of addressing the CRTC
3 Commissioners and Commission.
4 1380 My name is Zelda Young. I am a
5 Canadian-born Jew, producer and host of Shalom Jewish
6 programs on CHIN-AM and FM radio for the past 22 years
7 and also for seven years a part of the CHIN television
8 family on CityTV as producer and host of a Canadian
9 Jewish talk program called Tapestry.
10 1381 My late father, Sam Yochun, (ph) met
11 Johnny Lombardi in the 1950s at then CKFH, which was
12 Foster Hewitt's sports station. My father's English
13 was not at its best and he was made fun of by many
14 other Canadian radio producers of non-ethnic
15 backgrounds. He didn't seem to mind though. He was
16 fiercely proud to be doing what he loved producing, the
17 unheard of at that time, a Canadian Jewish program.
18 1382 That's where Johnny Lombardi and my
19 dad's paths crossed. They both had major dreams of one
20 day having a multicultural radio station.
21 1383 After several years of being not only
22 at CKFH, but at other radio stations that allowed them
23 the opportunity for several years to have the show on,
24 they would say, "We no longer want the program," and on
25 my dad would go to the next radio station.
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1 1384 Anyway, with Johnny Lombardi's
2 perseverance and hard work, in 1966 CHIN RADIO was
3 born. My dad was the very first producer onboard. I
4 remember because I grew up with the Lombardi family
5 basically.
6 1385 It was difficult, to say the least,
7 to get Canadian Jews to get involved in their heritage.
8 They felt that they must support Israel, both through
9 funding and in other ways. But my dad worked very hard
10 and he changed the perceptions of Canadian Jews that we
11 must have a voice as well in Canadian multicultural
12 radio through CHIN RADIO.
13 1386 In 1976 I joined the ranks of
14 producers on CHIN and, unfortunately, in 1979 my dad
15 passed away.
16 1387 It was really a struggle to get
17 advertisers and Canadian Jewish organizations to share
18 their awareness with our community, but we did it and
19 now every major Jewish organization and group shares
20 their news, views and other things with the community
21 on our Jewish programs on CHIN AM and FM and I have
22 submitted many letters of their support.
23 1388 I am very proud to be a part of the
24 CHIN family of broadcasters and have the chance to
25 share my community's wealth of knowledge and expertise
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1 with people of all ethnic and Canadian backgrounds.
2 1389 Johnny Lombardi has been both a
3 mentor and a friend to me and has encouraged me every
4 step of my journey. I thank you, the CRTC and CHIN
5 RADIO, for affording the multicultural community
6 opportunity to build this wonderful Canadian mosaic
7 which helps make it a more diverse society and a vital
8 link to the global community in the next millennium.
9 1390 Thank you very much.
10 1391 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
11 much, Ms Young.
12 1392 MS RHÉAUME: Our next speaker is Mr.
13 Frank Alvarez, President of CIRV Radio.
14 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
15 1393 MR. ALVAREZ: Good evening, Madam
16 Chairperson, members of the Commission and Commission
17 and staff.
18 1394 My name is Frank Alvarez. I am the
19 president of CIRV Radio International. I am here today
20 speaking as President of CIRV-FM and also on behalf of
21 the different language produces of CIRV.
22 1395 CIRV-FM is an ethnic stations
23 broadcasting here in Toronto. From our modest
24 beginnings as a low-power station licensed by this
25 Commission in 1986, we have grown to become a major
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1 provider of ethnic programming to the residents of the
2 Greater Toronto C.M.A. Despite our power limitations,
3 we currently broadcast at 1,000 watts, we serve 12
4 different language groups from Whitby in the east to
5 Aurora in the north to Burlington in the west.
6 1396 In a way, our station is a result of
7 the Commission's 1985 ethnic broadcasting policy as we
8 were licensed the year after its publication. We feel
9 that the policy has served the ethnic communities,
10 particularly in large markets very well, and we are
11 here today to do several things.
12 1397 We would like to give you a brief
13 synopsis of the changes we have witnessed in the
14 communities we serve.
15 1398 We would also like to suggest the
16 areas of your policy that need to be updated to reflect
17 these changes.
18 1399 We would like and would be pleased to
19 reply to any questions you might have about the
20 operations of an ethnic broadcasting radio station or
21 any other matters that you feel relevant, and we wanted
22 to hear what the stakeholders who were present here
23 today and yesterday had to say so that we could build
24 upon your consultations in preparing our written brief
25 for March 4.
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1 1400 Bur first let me note the successes
2 of the policy and the principles that we feel your
3 decision resulting from this process should be based
4 on. Your policy has resulted in an explosion of ethnic
5 stations in this city. We now have six full time radio
6 stations whose signals are receivable in the GTA.
7 Between us, we serve over 50 groups in over 50
8 languages with the largest groups, such as italians,
9 Portuguese, Chinese and the South Asian communities
10 receiving over 100 hours of radio programming per week.
11 1401 At the same time, much smaller sized
12 linguistic and cultural communities such as the
13 Filipinos, the Japanese, Malays, Slovenians,
14 Bulgarians, Lithuanians, Thais, Arabs, Iranians and
15 other groups whose size would not be able to support a
16 stand alone station, or who could not afford to
17 purchase time on conventional stations receiving from a
18 half hour to several hours of programming per week.
19 And, of course, there are a great number of groups
20 receiving somewhere between these figures.
21 1402 Furthermore, there are a number of
22 SCMO services providing 24 hours a day services to
23 specific single language communities.
24 1403 In television, we have an ethnic
25 television station here in Toronto providing services
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1 to third-language communities here, as well as
2 elsewhere in Ontario. We have specialty services that
3 provide programs in Italian, Spanish, Chinese and South
4 Asian languages and a licensed service, not yet
5 launched, which will provide Greek-language programs.
6 1404 It is important for the Commission to
7 understand the real need for access through the cable
8 companies for new ethnic TV services.
9 1405 What good is it to be issued a
10 licence whether to a Greek or portuguese broadcaster,
11 if we have no means of delivering that mandate?
12 1406 We firmly believe that the key answer
13 is cable access.
14 1407 We also support that Canadians should
15 have the first opportunity to apply for new unilingual
16 TV ethnic services. As well, an opportunity should be
17 given to foreign television services, but only with
18 Canadian partners.
19 1408 A number of us also provide a few
20 hours a week of programming to mainstream television
21 stations. This proliferation of services happened for
22 two reasons -- the dynamism of the producers and
23 broadcasters who wish to serve their communities and
24 the friendly policy and licensing framework put in
25 place by the Commission.
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1 1409 In terms of radio, the combination of
2 limiting entry to what the market can support while
3 insisting on a minimum contribution from each ethnic
4 broadcaster has meant that we can afford to extend
5 service to the communities that are not yet big enough
6 or economically well enough established to be able to
7 support programming. At the same time, you have not
8 limited access to program sources unreasonably.
9 1410 This has also meant that we can
10 provide local programming of relevance to people living
11 here in Toronto, as well as more general sports, music
12 and information programming.
13 1411 We believe that the fundamental
14 principles underpinning your regulation of our industry
15 should remain:
16 1412 Definition of what an ethnic program
17 and station are;
18 1413 Requirement for minimum levels of
19 service from ethnic broadcasters;
20 1414 Limits on how much ethnic programming
21 mainstream broadcasters can provide in markets;
22 1415 Giving a first chance to Canadian
23 entrepreneurs to provide services of relevance to
24 Canadians of non-English, non-French and non-aboriginal
25 origin.
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1 1416 The changing face of ethnic Toronto.
2 My comments are not based on an analysis of Stats
3 Canada data, but rather on our day-to-day personal
4 experience in serving the ethnic communities of the
5 Toronto area. The ethnic communities have changed
6 dramatically since the Commission introduce its policy
7 in 1985. These changes have taken a number of forms:
8 1417 The numbers, as the Commission notes
9 in its Public Notice, one in three Torontonians speak a
10 language other than English or French at home.
11 1418 The changing source of immigration,
12 fewer and fewer of the new immigrants coming to Canada
13 are from what were the traditional countries of origin
14 in Europe, and many more are coming from Africa, Asia
15 South and Central America and the Caribbean. These
16 communities are arriving in large numbers and many of
17 them are seeking service in their languages. In
18 addition, many of them have distinctive cultures, but
19 speak English as a first language.
20 1419 What were originally outsider
21 communities are now mainstream, the Italian,
22 Portuguese, Chinese and other immigrant communities are
23 now mainstream, with Cabinet Ministers, leaders of
24 commerce, arts, sports and other fields of endeavour
25 coming from these groups. Many of these communities
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1 are now in their third and fourth generations in
2 Canada. Their needs are significantly different than
3 those of their grandparents and parents. While many
4 listen and watch mainstream radio and television
5 exclusively, they also want to maintain contact with
6 their roots.
7 1420 Ethnic groups are moving to the
8 suburbs, while the original patterns of immigration saw
9 new Canadians congregate in the downtown areas and
10 create the Little Polands in the Roncesvales area,
11 Little Italy on College Street and St. Clair and
12 Chinatown on Dundas Street.
13 1421 As these groups have become
14 established, they have moved to suburbs, such as
15 Woodbridge, Richmond hill, Markham, Mississauga and
16 Malton. In many cases, they do not receive our signal
17 as well as they were accustomed to when they lived in
18 downtown Toronto.
19 1422 With the establishment of significant
20 populations of ethnic groups have followed the
21 businesses and the arts, I doubt if there are many, if
22 any, cuisines from around the world that cannot be
23 found somewhere in a Toronto restaurant. And the
24 groups have brought their music, dance and other
25 cultural pursuits here.
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1 1423 We have a number of excellent singers
2 and musicians that we recorded here at CIRV. This is
3 the latest edition, and there are a few small ethnic
4 recording companies and distributors. But they remain
5 at a local level and the quality of production is
6 uneven. In addition, many of the recordings by
7 Canadians of ethnic origin do not meet the MAPL
8 criteria and may need to be revised.
9 1424 We also believe that a catalogue with
10 Canadian recordings made by the ethnic communities
11 should be circulated among the different ethnic
12 broadcasters among the different markets.
13 1425 Implications for the ethnic policy.
14 These changes have resulted in a much more diverse
15 grouping of ethnic communities, with not only
16 differences of ethnic origin between communities, but
17 generational, gender and many other differences within
18 the communities. There are a variety of needs to be
19 served out there that we think will require changes in
20 the Commission's ethnic policy.
21 1426 Requirements for an ethnic station in
22 the larger urban communities: There are a number of
23 things that should be explored here.
24 1427 If a radio station is going to
25 benefit from the market protection afforded an ethnic
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1 station on format, should it not do more than 60 per
2 cent ethnic programming, at least in a major market
3 like Toronto? In practice, we believe that Toronto
4 ethnic stations -- Toronto area ethnic stations are
5 over 90 per cent ethnic programs.
6 1428 It is not clear what purpose the
7 stations that program between 15 per cent and 40 per
8 cent serve, nor is it clear why mainstream radio
9 stations in these markets should be able to do 15 per
10 cent ethnic programming.
11 1429 At the same time, to ensure that
12 smaller groups receive a minimal level of service, we
13 need to consider what the minimum number of groups that
14 an ethnic radio station should serve should be.
15 1430 Conversely, should we not drop
16 minimum requirements for Types A and B programs/ More
17 and more, we feel that bilingual programming mixed with
18 English aimed at the specific needs of a community can
19 serve the needs of our communities in two ways: It can
20 serve the younger generations who are still interested
21 in their roots, but whose mastery of the language is
22 less, and it can serve those with poor English to
23 develop their language skills.
24 1431 At the same time, we need new and
25 innovative ways to reach the communities that have
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1 migrated out to the suburbs and those in smaller
2 centres.
3 1432 Perhaps we should revisit the limit
4 of 15 per cent ethnic programs in these communities.
5 It is difficult to see what purpose is served by
6 requiring applications for going beyond 15 per cent.
7 On the other hand, perhaps higher thresholds level
8 after which requirements to serve multiple communities
9 could be considered.
10 1433 We may want to consider
11 re-broadcasters and partial re-broadcasters to reach
12 out to some of those communities. Once digital radio
13 arrives, single frequency network might be a way to do
14 this.
15 1434 We may wish to consider a
16 redefinition of Canadian content for purposes of ethnic
17 music recordings, as well as means to give some
18 recognition for the many local programs we do as
19 Canadian content. Of course, that we base this need on
20 our own experience as a broadcaster in the Toronto
21 area, we cannot speak about the needs of the ethnic
22 stations elsewhere, namely in Vancouver, Montreal,
23 Edmonton or Winnipeg.
24 1435 A redefinition of Canadian content
25 would consequently result in the increase of Canadian
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1 content, at which time we would urge the Commission to
2 phase in such an increase.
3 1436 We do not intend to make specific
4 recommendations at this time, but rather indicate some
5 general areas of concern and where we might be able to
6 improve the services made available to the communities
7 that we serve. We intend to work with the Canadian
8 Association of Ethnic Broadcasters to develop a written
9 brief that we will file with you on March 4.
10 1437 Thank you for the opportunity to meet
11 with you today. I would be more than pleased to answer
12 any questions that you may wish to pose. Thank you
13 very much.
14 1438 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
15 much, Mr. Alvarez. You will forgive us if we don't ask
16 any questions, but we still have six parties to go.
17 1439 MR. ALVAREZ: Thank you so much.
18 1440 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you.
19 1441 MS RHÉAUME: The next presenter is
20 Mr. Farook Hossain Kahn.
21 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
22 1442 MR. KAHN: Good evening,
23 Commissioners, ladies and gentlemen.
24 1443 Thank you very much for giving me the
25 opportunity to express our views regarding the third
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1 language and community programming on TV media.
2 1444 My name is Farook Hossain Kahn. I am
3 the president of the Bangladesh Awami League of Canada
4 and Director of the Canada Bangladesh Chamber of
5 Commerce. Both the organizations are working actively
6 with the Bangladeshi communities and the other South
7 Asian communities to improve the cultural heritage and
8 economic growth.
9 1445 I am also the past Director and
10 Treasurer of the Coalition of Agencies Serving South
11 Asians, which represents more than 60 communities in
12 the Greater Toronto Area.
13 1446 I have directed and produced a few
14 Bengali community programs on the then Maclean Hunter
15 Cable TV and on the Rogers Community 10.
16 1447 We are very, very glad that Canada
17 has a framework to protect its culture. We are also
18 very glad that Canada has developed and articulated a
19 multicultural policy. Multiple cultures are part of
20 the Canadian culture. Multiculture programming and
21 broadcasting needs to be cherished, protected and
22 nurtured.
23 1448 We believe that the regulatory
24 environment and the multicultural broadcasting policy
25 continue to protect the local ethnic multilingual
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1 national broadcasters such as ATN, the Asian Television
2 Network. ATN has to thrive and ATN has to reflect the
3 local communities such as ours in its programming. We
4 see local artists, local talents and local
5 entertainment industry emerging in the multicultural
6 context with and through ATN.
7 1449 Canadian content is as important
8 within the multicultural context as it is in the
9 mainstream context. This mean that no licences be
10 granted where ethnic programming does not reflect local
11 Canadian ethic communities where Canadian artists,
12 actors, technicians, are not part of such productions.
13 1450 It is very important to have a media
14 like the Asian Television network for the South Asian
15 communities and our heartiest thanks to the CRTC for
16 granting a licence to ATN to broadcast the ethnic
17 programs which is helping us to keep and promote our
18 own culture identity in this multicultural society.
19 1451 Asian Television network is the only
20 channel in Canada which is bridging our cultural gap.
21 Since the South Asian community is the second largest
22 ethnic group in Greater Toronto after the Chines, the
23 ATN has become a very popular channel among the South
24 Asian communities. Though the countries in South Asia,
25 such as Bangladesh, india, pakistan and Sri Lanka have
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1 different languages, but most of the population either
2 speaks or understands the Hindi, Urdu and Bengali
3 languages. As a result, the people in our South Asian
4 communities in Canada are equally enjoying the programs
5 aired by the ATN.
6 1452 On the occasion of Bangladeshi
7 Victory Day we have produced a two and a half hour
8 Bengali program on our language and culture with the
9 help and broadcasted by Asian Television network, which
10 was viewed and enjoyed by a large number of
11 Bangladeshis living in Canada. At present we are
12 working on two more projects with ATN. We have a lot
13 of talented people in our community who can create
14 community programs based on our culture and religion.
15 I believe it will lessen our dependability on foreign
16 films and other programs. Moreover, it will create
17 more jobs in the country and we will be able to build
18 our own cultural and religious foundation for our
19 future generations.
20 1453 We are urging the CRTC that full
21 access should be available to multicultural programming
22 for the third languages. It is our case that this
23 means full access to Asian Television network on cable
24 and other distribution forms in a meaningful way. At
25 this time our community does not grudge the $15
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1 subscription fee. It does, however, object to having
2 to invest $700 in a satellite or to pay an additional
3 $10 per month for a digital box. It is especially hard
4 for low-income people and seniors in our Bangladeshi
5 community -- the people who need ATN most.
6 1454 Moreover, due to the extra cost
7 involved with ATN, not only the viewers are restricted,
8 but the advertisers also do not advertise to the tune
9 and scale that would normally attract millions of
10 viewers throughout Canada.
11 1455 If the third-language channel like
12 ATN channel is accessible from coast to coast, I
13 strongly believe that it will tremendously improve the
14 cultural sensitivity and will bridge the cultural gap.
15 Religious and cultural upbringing starts early in life.
16 Most Asian women being homemakers constitute a very
17 large potential viewer for ATN, which is now being
18 constrained due to the extra cost.
19 1456 Most importantly, our Bangladeshi
20 children are also deprived from the opportunity to
21 entrenching our cultural and religious roots into their
22 minds.
23 1457 Thank you again for giving me the
24 opportunity.
25 1458 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you so much
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1 for hanging in there and presenting your views to us at
2 this late hour.
3 1459 MR. KAHN: Thank you.
4 1460 MS RHÉAUME: Our next presenter is Ms
5 Betty Skoutakis. Betty Skoutakis.
6 1461 Then we will go to Ms Estela Cuenca.
7 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
8 1462 MS CUENCA: Good evening.
9 1463 My name is Estela Cuenca. My field
10 is education. I work as a program co-ordinator of
11 volunteers who work with children and youth promoting
12 academic excellence among Hispanic youth. I also work
13 in a music program fostering the love of music in
14 children and youth.
15 1464 I am a member of the board of
16 directors of Open Experience Theatre, an organization
17 founded in 1979 which has presented numerous
18 award-winning productions, both for the theatre and
19 television and has been a catalyst within the Hispanic
20 community for the production of many festivals,
21 artistic exhibitions and more.
22 1465 I am here perhaps not as prepared as
23 I would to be because I found out very late about these
24 consultations, and although I knew that I might not
25 have enough time to prepare myself, I felt that it was
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1 important that our voices be heard. So I met with a
2 group of people who have serious concerns about
3 Canadian broadcasting and the lack of a true reflection
4 of our multicultural and multilingual reality in what
5 is broadcast on Canadian radio and television.
6 1466 We know that there are a lot of
7 technical considerations, and that we are not experts
8 in all the legislation that exists. But we do know
9 that, in spite of all the well intended legislation,
10 and the many policies which are written for the various
11 departments and agencies. The bottom line is that we,
12 the ethnics, as we are called, contribute our fair
13 share to the economy, the development and the
14 well-being of this country, yet we are blatantly
15 non-existent when it comes to the reflection of
16 Canadian society in the radio, television and new media
17 which is seen at home and abroad. And this is not
18 right.
19 1467 The following are some of the issues
20 which came up in our discussions and which we submit
21 for your consideration.
22 1468 Multiculturalism is the reality of
23 Canada. Multiculturalism is not silent. We
24 communicate with one another in our original languages,
25 but also in the official languages. Unfortunately,
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1 Canada's Official Languages Act has been used to
2 perpetuate discrimination and favouritism. This is
3 unfair and must be rectified.
4 1469 A national multilingual network to be
5 broadcast on basic cable, so that the ethnics don't
6 have to pay extra for service in their language, is
7 more than due and necessary.
8 1470 Since third-language productions are
9 not only essential to the expression and communication
10 of our multicultural society, but can also be exported
11 to larger international markets, we would like to see
12 support given to the productions which could be done in
13 third languages. These would not only serve and
14 reflect the communities for which are made, but can
15 then be exported to larger markets. We could and
16 should try to get support from the Department of
17 Industry, Trade and Commerce.
18 1471 Also, in order to comply with the
19 Official Languages Act, versioning could be done to
20 English and/or French.
21 1472 The Canadian Broadcasting Corporation
22 Act and the CRTC's policy on the CBC should be amended
23 to ensure that Canada's diversity, including our
24 multicultural, multiracial and multilingual reality are
25 fairly and equitably reflected in our programming.
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1 After all, it is our public broadcasting service paid
2 by all and not only anglo/franco Canadians.
3 1473 The future digital compression
4 channel will open doors for more channels. We should
5 prepare ourselves to deal with this. By ensuring that
6 Canadian content, especially that produced in third
7 languages are so appealing as to retain the viewership
8 and consumption of Canadians and internationals.
9 1474 Canadian-made productions and
10 Canadian broadcasting are vital to our culture,
11 industry and sovereignty and must take precedence over
12 imported or foreign productions and broadcasting.
13 1475 New media is also a very important
14 consideration. Soon, although many are doing it now,
15 who are not satisfied with information and programming
16 in their own languages are turning to the Internet for
17 information and entertainment. As Canadians we must be
18 in the avant guard to provide the necessary services
19 and even better to export high-quality information and
20 programming. However, access is the domain of the
21 wealthier segments of Canada and assistance must be
22 provided so that the new media is accessible to all.
23 1476 There is very serious concern that
24 the CRTC has allowed the market to dictate what happens
25 in the broadcasting industry. The weaker and
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1 under-represented communities will be further
2 debilitated unless mechanisms are established to ensure
3 that access and opportunities are available for all.
4 1477 Also, it is very important that
5 productions not only reflect the ethnic communities as
6 ghettos and/or stories of the past. They be fresh,
7 current and vibrant, with stories of what is happening
8 today, promoting cross-cultural understanding.
9 1478 It is fundamental that the CRTC
10 comprehends and acts to safeguard, nurture and protect
11 the intrinsic value of all of our various heritage
12 languages as vehicles of cultural identity, retention
13 of family and cultural values, pride in our roots, for
14 the fostering of international relations. Third
15 language and ethnic broadcasting are necessary to
16 Canada as a nation.
17 1479 I will be remiss not to express our
18 apprehension for the Commission's lack of understanding
19 of the importance of third language and ethnic
20 broadcasting as it was demonstrated by the short and
21 poor notification of these consultations and the short
22 time allotted for the presentations.
23 1480 It is important that the
24 Commissioners of the CRTC better educate themselves as
25 to the importance and impact of our multicultural,
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1 multiracial, multilingual reality in Canada and act
2 according.
3 1481 It is important that the
4 Commissioners keep an open perspective and vision which
5 should help them to distinguish between the needs of
6 the people of Canada, which are the majority from the
7 interests of the broadcasters who will be making
8 polished and well-prepared submissions. The CRTC must
9 be always cognizant that its mandate is to serve the
10 people of Canada and not the interest of the few.
11 1482 All broadcasters, be they public or
12 private, must assume their responsibility for ensuring
13 that Canada's diversity is fairly and equitably
14 reflected in their programming.
15 1483 The CRTC must require cable companies
16 to provide community programming. It used to be
17 better, but has been gradually disappearing.
18 1484 There is a lot of ethnic or
19 third-language programming on mainstream stations
20 through the brokerage. The CRTC must review where the
21 communities gain or become disempowered by this
22 arrangement. Who controls the content? Does the fact
23 that they include foreign materials in a program which
24 is packaged and broadcast in Canada in a third language
25 make it Canadian content?
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1 1485 The CRTC should establish the proper
2 mechanisms to ensure that third language and ethnic
3 productions have fair and equitable access to funding
4 for the production of programs which tell their
5 stories, which are also Canadian stories.
6 1486 Third language or ethnic productions
7 which lack proper funding perpetuate the myth that they
8 are low quality and, therefore, not worth producing.
9 1487 Most of the government funding
10 agencies grant funding to productions which care
11 produced in either of the official languages. This is
12 highly discriminatory and should be changed. Why
13 should only a fraction of our society receive funding
14 when all taxpayers contribute to the programs.
15 1488 Certification of Canadian content
16 should be given to productions which accurately reflect
17 Canada's demographic reality and it should be a
18 condition for the granting or renewal of licences of
19 funding. This would ensure that all productions will
20 take us into consideration and seek our writers,
21 authors, musicians, actors, et cetera.
22 1489 The CRTC should require cable
23 companies to reactivate community channels across the
24 country and provide access especially to the weaker
25 communities.
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1 1490 The CRTC should encourage and promote
2 the portability of programs so that a program which is
3 produced in a specific city could be shared by also
4 being broadcast in other cities across Canada. This
5 allows for the cost of production to be split between
6 the different cities that receive the program while
7 also allowing wider viewership.
8 1491 CBC radio has four channels. They
9 broadcast only in the official languages. Is that
10 fair? Is that representative? Most ethnic
11 communities, third language, should be given access to
12 these stations.
13 1492 Canadian content must be expanded to
14 promote intercultural understanding.
15 1493 The Broadcasting Act has been in
16 place for many years. For many years it has also made
17 reference to the retention and enhancement of our
18 cultural diversity, but the reality of the
19 implementation has been very poor. We hope that these
20 consultations are not just another exercise in
21 futility, but that the Commission comes out with an
22 integrational policy which has teeth and which will
23 ensure that the demographic reality of Canada is fairly
24 and equitably reflected in all of our radio, television
25 and new media in Canada.
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1 1494 In conclusion, I would like to
2 reinforce that I have the voice of the Hispanic youth,
3 hoping that the outcome of this event will bring new
4 opportunities to them promoting in this manner young
5 writers, young musicians and all Hispanic actors, and
6 that with Canadians are represented on the basis of
7 equity and equality. These positive changes are
8 required to be seen on television and radio.
9 1495 Thank you very much for allowing me
10 to be here tonight. I am almost the last person.
11 Good-bye.
12 1496 THE CHAIRPERSON: Sorry to disappoint
13 you, Ms Cuenca, there are still four more to go.
14 1497 But thank you for being with us and
15 thank you to you also for staying with us to such a
16 late hour.
17 1498 Madam Secretary.
18 1499 MS RHÉAUME: The next presenters are
19 Mr. Spyros Bourdorkis and Ms Vicky Karpeta. Mr. Spyros
20 Bourdorkis.
21 1500 We will then go to Ms Krystyna
22 Piotrowski and Ms Isabella Walicht.
23 1501 THE CHAIRPERSON: Please push -- oh,
24 not on the record.
25 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
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1 1502 THE CHAIRPERSON: We want you here
2 and welcome. You can begin any time you are ready. I
3 am very sorry for all of the confusion. It was
4 confusing for us too because the response was so
5 overwhelming that we ended up having to add first one
6 day and then a second day. We were only scheduled to
7 be here one day. It's a good sign that there is that
8 much interest.
9 1503 COMMISSIONER LANGFORD: And like the
10 doors of TVOntario we are voice activated. As soon as
11 you start we open up and we listen.
12 1504 THE CHAIRPERSON: Press the white
13 button.
14 1505 MS PIOTROWSKI: I will probably
15 start. My name is Krystyna Piotrowski. Me and
16 Isabella, we are here on behalf of Polish Radio Program
17 and Teen Radio. My husband, Jack Piotrowski, he is a
18 producer. Me and Isabella, we are the hostesses of the
19 program.
20 1506 So, I would like to give a voice to
21 Isabella because, as you saw, that she is a great
22 speaker.
23 1507 MS WALICHT: Not really, but give me
24 the microphone and I stay on it.
25 1508 Anyway, as Krystyna said, I will be
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1 speaking mainly on behalf of the Polish program
2 Epichine (ph). You have heard all the general comments
3 from almost everybody during the day. I will
4 concentrate on the Polish program.
5 1509 The Polish program last year
6 celebrated its tenth anniversary. The program is
7 called Radio Polonia. Now, how qualified are the
8 producers and how popular was this program? It is
9 sufficient to say that the air time has increased from
10 the original half an hour into three hours daily
11 broadcasting from 11:00 a.m. until 2:00 p.m. You can
12 judge the popularity of the program by the tremendous
13 support among the advertisers and the responses that we
14 get from the listening audience, and the audience
15 represents all age groups. Also, it is a cross-section
16 of almost all professions and fields of interest.
17 1510 Last year on April Fool's Day,
18 Krystyna made a joke. She said that the program of
19 Radio Polonia is going to be limited to only a half an
20 hour daily. It was meant as an April Fool's joke.
21 What happened, people took it seriously. All the lines
22 became instantly busy. Everybody was calling with
23 people venting frustration and anger on the air and
24 comments ranging from blaming political, economic and
25 anti-Polish sources, to outright donations of cash and
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1 establishing a foundation to keep Radio Polonia on the
2 air. Some even suggesting buying CHIN or another
3 station and broadcasting in Polish 24-hours a day.
4 1511 You should have listened to those
5 people. They were really serious. I don't know how
6 Krystyna felt afterwards when she had to admit that it
7 was a joke. However, even after that the people kept
8 flooding the studio with calls and saying that in the
9 future it could have happened. We always have some
10 unforeseen circumstances and a situation like that
11 could really happen in the future.
12 1512 Now, I do some live interviews,
13 interpretations and comments on the air in Polish and
14 in English as well. I can testify to the extreme
15 dedication of the producers, Richard and Krystyna
16 Piotrowski to the program and the listening audience.
17 Numerously, I have witnessed all the phone line lights
18 blinking simultaneously as soon as the listeners are
19 told the magic words, "call the studio".
20 1513 Even before anybody mentions the
21 studio number, all the lights are on; all the lines are
22 busy. So, I suppose it must be the most popular number
23 with listeners of Polish program, Radio Polonia.
24 1514 Even though they have another number
25 which is available to call and leave the messages, the
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1 voice mail over there is always full and requires
2 emptying every three hours. I suppose it shows you the
3 popularity of the program.
4 1515 Why is it so successful? I suppose
5 it is because it popularized the Polish language,
6 culture, news and live interviews. You can see people
7 from all walks of life that come to the studio and the
8 same thing can be said about the people who are being
9 interviewed.
10 1516 I myself remember interviewing many
11 people from Poland and people of Polish descent from
12 all over the world. For example, I interviewed Bobby
13 Vinton who sold some 4 million records and at some time
14 was more popular than Elvis Presley. When Bobby's
15 career appeared to be ending, he wrote a song that
16 became an international hit, My Melody of Love, which I
17 suppose lots of people know, parts of which are sung in
18 Polish and it was inspired by his mother who is Polish.
19 1517 The success of this Bobby Vinton is
20 an inspiration to all and above all you can contribute
21 to all success if you appreciate your own native
22 language or language of your ancestors.
23 1518 Another example of inspiration is,
24 for example, success at the World Judo Championship.
25 So now here we have an artist and now I am going into
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1 sports. That world championship took place in Hamilton
2 and it was some three years ago. The Polish judo team
3 was interviewed by me and Krystyna and they seemed a
4 little bit down because of all the pressure and
5 inability to believe in their own talents.
6 1519 However, they stated to us that
7 cheering loudly would really help them. So, we really
8 did put our efforts in cheering because they captured
9 two most prestigious gold medals, all-weight category
10 for male, all-weight category for female, and it was
11 the first time in judo history that those titles and
12 medals were taken from the Japanese.
13 1520 In post-championship interviews both
14 medallists admitted that all that Polish cheering and
15 exposure to sympathetic Polish community here helped
16 them to capture the gold medals.
17 1521 Now, I am saying Polish-Polish, but I
18 suppose all those things apply to other languages,
19 whether somebody is from the Japanese community or the
20 Italian community or many other nations, the same thing
21 would apply. We look for inspiration, we look for
22 language at which people can more express themselves
23 and empathize with.
24 1522 I have also interviewed a chief of
25 police, David Budby (ph) and we had a discussion on the
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1 different ways of police operation in Canada and
2 Poland. He was especially impressed with using canine
3 units to track down criminals in Poland and in
4 comparison to Canada they were extremely highly
5 advanced.
6 1523 So, concrete things happen besides
7 discussions. Chief Budby and Chief Fontina (ph) from
8 London visited Poland and signed a co-operation
9 agreement in police work between Poland and Canada and
10 also between -- I think I am going to have a glass of
11 water or something. I have to make it fast so you can
12 go home.
13 1524 Also, they signed some agreements
14 specifically on the work between Warsaw and Toronto,
15 the cities who have become twins. So positive things
16 do happen from co-operation and understanding between
17 different societies.
18 1525 For example, recently Jean Chretien
19 and his trade team to Poland and other European
20 countries. They had signed some 40 deals in Poland
21 worth millions of dollars. We had a consular from
22 Toronto, Chris Corwin-Korchinski, who is of Polish
23 descent and he was part of that delegation and we had
24 him yesterday on the air of Radio Polonia saying his
25 comments about the trade mission to Poland.
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1 1526 Other people we interview are movie
2 producers, actors, entertainers, economists,
3 politicians, social workers, teachers, policemen and
4 many other different professions, as well as ordinary
5 people.
6 1527 The community also helps police in
7 their investigation. Appeals in a native language
8 somehow make people more trustworthy. Late last year
9 when a Polish couple was murdered, as a Radio Polonia
10 initiative a police representative went live on the air
11 to appeal for information and witnesses. So, we can
12 see positive things happening because people of
13 different cultures and languages have different views
14 of police.
15 1528 Sometime the views develop in the
16 country of origin and not necessarily they would be
17 trustworthy of police. Appealing in the native
18 language on public broadcasting helps in police work
19 and investigation.
20 1529 Now, who are the listeners of Radio
21 Polonia? The age varies, from children to seniors.
22 There is a place for children on the air, especially
23 during the summer where a half an hour is devoted to
24 them. Kids prepare their own program, sing and talk.
25 The response is very positive.
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1 1530 Excuse me, I usually don't get like
2 that. If I have more people I could --
3 1531 THE CHAIRPERSON: You have had quite
4 an adventure. I think that's allowed.
5 1532 MS WALICHT: Thank you.
6 1533 Seniors are usually first to pledge
7 help to the needy. They often call the studio. This
8 year, 1999, has been declared the International Year of
9 the Older Person. Ethnic broadcasting has a great
10 contribution to make and Canada has a great
11 contribution to make.
12 1534 The age of the average Canadian is
13 going up steadily. Canadian seniors are from almost
14 all world countries of origin and as such a perfect
15 model to lead the work in celebrating the International
16 Year of the Older Person and in promoting
17 intergenerational relations.
18 1535 In many European and other countries
19 elders are looked upon with respect and appreciation of
20 great wisdom to pass on to future generations, an
21 especially important role in mentoring and motivating
22 the youngest members of society, children. Now, this
23 is very important in education and in Canada, and
24 Ontario specifically, is going through educational
25 reforms right now. So, I think those things would
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1 help. Also, expressing one's self in the native
2 language has many advantages.
3 1536 What changes we would like to see in
4 ethnic broadcasting? Well, I think almost everything
5 was said today. I would only like to add that we would
6 like to have more air time for all ethnic languages.
7 Each time policy makers, politicians and big media
8 moguls make decisions for greater profits, like for
9 example the recent merger of two TV networks, making it
10 the largest in North America. There is always a fear,
11 society needs respect and support may suffer.
12 1537 In financial support, it is very
13 difficult for small producers, such as the producers of
14 Radio Polonia or indeed other producers of CHIN, to
15 compete with big moguls and yet it is the small
16 producers that make the biggest difference in society.
17 It's like in a close-knit family, that's where you are
18 shaped in effect for the future.
19 1538 I have a 14-year old daughter, Tanya,
20 and I mentioned to her about today's forum and she was
21 shocked that the CRTC could counsel all the language
22 stations in favour of official language station. All
23 her friends know Johnny Lombardi and many watch
24 Saturday and Sunday television programming in many
25 different languages, languages that they can identify
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1 with, that they speak with at home even though they
2 were born in Canada.
3 1539 She asked me to deliver a message,
4 not counselling, but supporting ethnic broadcasting and
5 this is on behalf of her and all her friends from St.
6 Martin's High School in Mississauga.
7 1540 What is the contribution to ethnic
8 programming to the community? Besides being able to
9 assure success of ethnic programming, small producers
10 give back to the community that supports the program.
11 Many times and free of charge they help in fundraising.
12 They always with teams supported telethons like the
13 Sick Kids' Telethon, Variety Village Telethon that
14 raise millions of dollars.
15 1541 They also are the first ones to
16 extend a helping hand to all the needy, disabled and
17 misfortunate. Last year's flooding in Poland prompted
18 Krystyna and Richard to go on the air and raise some
19 $50,000. Also, the flooding in Winnipeg prompted the
20 response and initiation of a Polish program to do the
21 fundraising for that community.
22 1542 Another time, an electromicroscope
23 was donated by Canadians of Polish descent for the
24 Medical Academy in Poland. It was worth about
25 $300,000. Now, Richard and Krystyna volunteered to
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1 raise funds for its installation and $20,000 was raised
2 in five days. People listen and people trust Krystyna
3 and Richard Piotrowski. It's an earned trust. It's
4 also appreciated by other producers at CHIN. I
5 witnessed myself the Croatian producer. He noticed
6 that we were doing a fundraising for a cause. He
7 considered the cause very worthy and he contributed
8 himself right away. I listen myself to almost all the
9 programs and I enjoy the music, I enjoy the language,
10 even though I may not understand.
11 1543 My son was speaking I think six or
12 seven languages when he was four years old because he
13 had all the friends who were speaking those languages.
14 I was very surprised when he came home one night and he
15 was speaking Arabic. Canada is a multicultural country
16 and a model to others in the equality of treatment of
17 all people. So, this is what Canada is all about,
18 equal treatment to all people, communities, regardless
19 of ethnic background and broadcasting in ethnic
20 languages provides a forum for the people where they
21 can better understand each other, vent their
22 frustration or praise whatever they want to praise and
23 respond better to appeals that are coming from those
24 who come from the same culture, background and speak
25 the same language.
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1 1544 Ethnic programming is a necessity,
2 the same as the Canadian commitment and popularization
3 of a multicultural society, a model to lead the world.
4 Europe unites, faiths unite, all people shall unite and
5 we all will have a better world. That's the end and
6 I'm tired. I want to go to sleep.
7 1545 Thank you.
8 1546 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you so much.
9 1547 MS WALICHT: And we all love Johnny
10 Lombardi. He's like a papa to us.
11 1548 THE CHAIRPERSON: He was here
12 earlier. I'm sorry, his son was here. Junior was
13 here.
14 1549 Thank you so much for being with us
15 and I know you have a long way to travel. I just want
16 to apologize again for the confusion, but I am really
17 glad that you made it and thank you very much for your
18 contribution.
19 1550 Thank you.
20 1551 MS RHÉAUME: Our final speaking of
21 the day is the Rev. Adolfo Puricelli.
22 1552 THE CHAIRPERSON: Rev. Puricelli.
23 1553 REV. PURICELLI: Adolfo for the
24 family.
25 1554 THE CHAIRPERSON: You have the
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1 distinction of being our final participant.
2 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION
3 1555 REV. PURICELLI: Yes, and I was told
4 that supper is around 1:00.
5 1556 I will try to summarize 15 pages. I
6 have a lot of sympathy for you, frankly, because you
7 are already submitted to this torture for seven or
8 eight hours, listening more or less to repetitive
9 things.
10 1557 I would like to start with a story,
11 if it is possible. An old rabbi once asked his pupils
12 how they could tell when the night has ended and the
13 day has begun. Could it be, asked one of the students,
14 when you can see an animal in the distance and tell
15 whether it's a sheep or a dog? No, answered the rabbi.
16 1558 Another asked is it when you can look
17 at a tree in the distance and tell whether it is a fig
18 tree or a peach tree? No, answered the rabbi.
19 1559 Then what is it, the pupils demanded.
20 It is when you can look on the face of any man or woman
21 and see that it is your sister or your brother because
22 if you cannot see this it is still night.
23 1560 I believe that the work that you are
24 doing is really to help us to see the faces of our
25 sisters and brothers and to encourage each other. That
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1 means I am going to summarize some of the things I was
2 trying to say a little more longer. The first thing is
3 to congratulate you for what you are doing at this
4 moment in the review.
5 1561 The second is to tell you that since
6 my position of Executive Director and senior pastor of
7 an ethnic congregation I see many times the influence,
8 the good influence that the mass media has on the life
9 of people. The concerns raised by your Public Notice
10 CRTC 1998-135 are extremely important. I am only going
11 to call your attention to one detail here. We plan to
12 submit to you a paper, so I mean it's okay.
13 1562 Let me express serious concern in
14 relation with the Spanish-speaking community, who
15 represents a very rich and complex background with more
16 than 25 countries of origin that speak and/or use
17 Spanish as a mother tongue and the good mix that we
18 have with native people, African, Asian and the
19 European influence.
20 1563 One of these countries today is the
21 United States of America, fourth in Spanish-speaking
22 population in the world and now becoming the first
23 ethnic minority with great political representation and
24 power at all levels of government of the United States.
25 1564 This USA Hispanic population is
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1 producing thousands of Hispanic programs through very
2 sophisticated areas, serving heavily the interests of
3 multinational economic sectors originating or operating
4 in the USA.
5 1565 In the same way that we are trying to
6 defend the content of our magazines, papers and
7 periodicals from the powerful influence from the USA,
8 we need to do our best to facilitate and defend the
9 economics and the content and production of programming
10 in music and so on.
11 1566 I am going to escape and only say
12 that we believe strongly and I believe strongly that
13 the Type A and D programs are needed and I represent
14 one of them when I explain why.
15 1567 I support, obviously, too the use of
16 the Type E programs because these programs can help all
17 the population to have more understanding of who we
18 were, who we are and who we are becoming in Canada
19 2000. I believe that that type of programming is very
20 good and very necessary for the general population in a
21 cross-cultural approach.
22 1568 I am going to emphasize other aspects
23 that are important, the intergenerational aspect of the
24 mass media communications gain more relevance for the
25 newcomers. The adult parents always like to encourage
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1 their children to learn and keep their mother tongue.
2 The Type A and D programming will continue making that
3 essential breach. We need to do that in many ways.
4 1569 There was some study done in the
5 eighties that shows that there are some languages that
6 we bring to Canada and that they are somehow a
7 different type of approach and schools are not
8 seriously considering to teach them in the schools and
9 it is very important.
10 1570 The seniors, grandmothers and
11 grandfathers of the newcomers, are arriving sometimes
12 too late to master the new languages in Canada, but the
13 ethnic programming Type A is the best vehicle to keep
14 them informed, alive and aware of what is going on in
15 Canada and in the world.
16 1571 To close my remarks, I would like to
17 exemplify with gratitude one of the good experiences in
18 Type A programming that I hope you will increase and
19 support for through the improvement of policies,
20 procedures and guidelines.
21 1572 Telelatino has programs in Italian,
22 Portuguese and Spanish. I live in a neighbourhood of
23 Canadians from Italian and Portuguese programs.
24 Several times in my talks to them in the past year I
25 have heard from them words of acknowledgment and
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1 appreciation for their program and the other programs.
2 I mean these people are following very closely the
3 thing.
4 1573 Specifically, I have known and
5 participated in the program of Laura Productions with
6 Telecide, "You Decide," all in Spanish. This is a
7 national program which reaches to Spanish-speaking
8 people from the whole country. It addresses topics of
9 need in the newcomers and helps to openly deal with
10 differences and in a very constructive and respectful
11 way. It also helps to integrate people to Canadian
12 society in a very meaningful way.
13 1574 This type of programming, A, is very,
14 very beneficial to all aspects of national and
15 international life. In this global village that we
16 live in, more and more of us belongs to two, three or
17 more social cultural backgrounds that need to be
18 reflected really in the policies of the CRTC.
19 1575 Thank you very much. The Creator of
20 all of us bless you and your important work.
21 1576 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very
22 much, Reverend. That's an appropriate note on which to
23 end today's session.
24 1577 I would like to thank all of you for
25 being here at such a late hour and for your
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1 contribution today and this session is adjourned. We
2 will reconvene tomorrow at 4:00 p.m.
3 --- Whereupon the hearing adjourned at 2325, to resume
4 on Wednesday, February 3, 1999 at 1600 / L'audience
5 est ajournée à 2325, pour reprendre le mercredi
6 3 février à 1600
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